Questions about Ismailism from a Sunni

[kmaherali]

1. Do Ismailis believe in the existence of Angels and Jinn?

According to Agakhan III in his memoir:
"Islam acknowledges the existence of angels, of great souls who have developed themselves to the highest possible planes of the human soul and higher, and who are centres of the forces which are scattered throughout the Universe. Without going as far as Christianity, Islam recognizes the existence of evil spirits which seek by means of their secret suggestions to us to turn us from good, from that straight way traced by God's finger for the eternal happiness of the humblest as of the greatest-Abraham, Jesus, Mohammed."

2. Do Ismailis believe that an Imam has knowledge of everything??

According to Agakhan III in his memoir:
"The Shias have therefore always held that after the Prophet's death, Divine power, guidance and leadership manifested themselves in Hazrat Ali as the first Imam or spiritual chief of the devout."

3. Do Ismailis outside the Indian subcontinent have scriptures besides the Ginans??

Yes the Ismailis outside the Indian Subcontinent have qasidas in Arabic and Persian composed by great Ismaili thinkers.

4. Do ismailis believe in cyclical time, forexample the Hindu belief in Yugas??

Yes belief in cyclical times is an essential aspect of Ismaili cosmology.

5. What do Ismailis believe about the Druze??

According to Agakhan III in his memoir:
"In the mountainous regions of Syria, for example, are to be found the Druzes, in their fastness in the Jebel Druze. They are really Ismailis who did not originally follow my family in their migration out of Egypt but remained with the memory of my ancestor, AI Hakem, the Fatimite Khalif of Egypt, but they established their doctrines on lines very similar to those of the Syrian Ismailis, who, in present times, are my followers."

6. Do Ismailis believe that Krishna was a Prophet or Imam??

According to Agakhan III in his memoir:
"All Islamic schools of thought accept it as a fundamental principle that for centuries, for thousands of years before the advent of Mohammed, there arose from time to time messengers, illumined by Divine Grace, for and among those races of the earth which had sufficiently advanced intellectually to comprehend such a message. Thus Abraham, Moses, Jesus and all the Prophets of Israel are universally accepted by Islam. Muslims indeed know no limitation merely to the Prophets of Israel; they are ready to admit that there were similar Divinely inspired messengers in other countriesGautama Buddha, Shri Krishna and Shri Ram in India, Socrates in Greece, the wise man of China and many other sages and saints among peoples and civilizations, trace of which we have lost. Thus man's soul has never been left without a specially inspired messenger from the soul that sustains, embraces and is the universe."

7. What do Ismailis believe about Jesus?
Do they believe, like Sunnis do, that he was not crucified, but was raised alive to heaven and will return to earth before the Day of Judgement??

The Quran states:
That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah.;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not (Sura An-Nisa; 4:157)

Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise (Sura An-Nia; 4:158)

The following is my interpretation of the above two ayats. The fact that it is mentioned: "but so it was made to appear to them" implies there was an appearance of this fact. Many Christian mystics have had visions of the crucification of Isa Nabi. So I believe that this event did take place.

However, the second verse states that Isa Nabi was really united with God. According to our Ginans, there is no death for such a soul anymore, i.e. it is immortal beyond death. In Ginan "Kal Pat Jal Pat" Peer Hassan Kabirdeen says: " Nisi jal hove ta kuchh kaal na aave" - meaning: If one has attained purity (through enlightenment), he/she is not affected by time or death.

Hence in reality he was not crucified or killed, rather, that event was a means towards his ultimate unity with God.

8.How can a non-Ismaili give bayah to the imam?

The present Imam emphasises the values of pluralism and ethics. If you are ethical and true to your faith, you will be guided to the right path.

[someone2]

Thank you for your replies.

They are very informative.



I want to ask some more questions about Ismailism.

1. What is a Pir? Is a Pir the same as a Prophet?

2. What is the Ismaili belief about Hazrat Muhammad (saw) and Hazrat Ali (ra)?
Do they



What is the ismaili belief abou the Prophets, Messengers, and Imams?
Do Ismailis consider them divine?
Is the Ismaili belief about them closer to the mainstream Twelvers, or to the Nusayri, or to the Bahai?

3. Do Ismailis believe the universe has an end?
Also, can you please tell me more about Ismaili cosmology and the Ismaili belief in cyclical time?

[someone2]

I accidentally typed question 2 incorrectly.

Question 2 should be:

2. What is the Ismaili belief about Hazrat Muhammad (saw) and Hazrat Ali (ra)?

Also, what is the Ismaili belief about the Prophets, Messengers, and Imams?
Do Ismailis believe they are divine?
Is the Ismaili belief about them closer to the mainstream Twelvers, or to the Nusayri, or to the Bahai?

[kmaherali]

1. What is a Pir? Is a Pir the same as a Prophet?
?

The Pir is the one who guides his murids to the Imam. The Pir's role is confined to our tariqah and the Prophet's role is more universal. Not all Prophets are Pirs. In the case of Prophet Muhammad,he was also the Pir of our tariqah. For more on this please go to and read the thread below.

Doctrines --> Imam and Pir

http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... ir+prophet

2. What is the Ismaili belief about Hazrat Muhammad (saw) and Hazrat Ali (ra)?
What is the ismaili belief abou the Prophets, Messengers, and Imams?
Do Ismailis consider them divine??

According to our constitution which I stated before (and which you did not read) Hazarat Ali inherited the role of Prophet Muhammad:

B) In accordance with Shia doctrine, tradition, and interpretation of history, the Holy Prophet (S.A.S.) designated and appointed his cousin and son-in-law Hazrat Mawlana Ali Amiru-l-Mu'minin (Alayhi-s-salam), to be the first Imam to continue the Ta'wil and Ta'lim of Allah's final message and to guide the murids, and proclaimed that the Imamat should continue by heredity through Hazrat Mawlana Ali (A.S.) and his daughter Hazrat Bibi Fatimat-az-Zahra, Khatun-i-Jannat Alayha-s-salam).

Please read the answers to your questions No, 2 & 6 in your previous set of questions above and mark the phrases "Divine power, guidance and leadership manifested themselves in Hazrat Ali", "there arose from time to time messengers, illumined by Divine Grace" and "they are ready to admit that there were similar Divinely inspired messengers in other countriesGautama Buddha". Don't these phrases indicate some form of divinity?

Is the Ismaili belief about them closer to the mainstream Twelvers, or to the Nusayri, or to the Bahai??

Yes very close except that we believe in the living Imam

3. Do Ismailis believe the universe has an end?
Also, can you please tell me more about Ismaili cosmology and the Ismaili belief in cyclical time?

Accodring to Agakhan III in his memoirs (which you have not read!):

"There is a fundamental difference between the Jewish idea of creation and that of Islam. The creation according to Islam is not a unique act in a given time but a perpetual and constant event; and God supports and sustains all existence at every moment by His will and His thought. Outside His will, outside His thought, all is nothing, even the things which seem to us absolutely self-evident such as space and time."

For more on cyclical times go to:

http://www.amiscorbin.com/textes/anglai ... 20Time.pdf

[shiraz.virani]

1. What is a Pir? Is a Pir the same as a Prophet?

i think brother meherali described it beautifully ....


2. What is the Ismaili belief about Hazrat Muhammad (saw) and Hazrat Ali (ra)?

2:124 And remember that Abraham was tried by his Lord with certain Commands, Which he Fulfilled: He said: I will Make thee an Imam to the Nations. He Pleaded: And also (Imams) from my offspring!. He answered: But My romise is not within the reach of Evil-doers.

Below is the Sunni commentary of Yusuf Ali on the above verse (2:124):

Kalimat, literally "words", here used in the mystic sense of God's
Will or Decree or Purpose. This verse may be taken to be the sum
of the verses following. In everything Abraham fulfilled God's
wish: he purified God's house; he built the sacred refuge of the
Kaba; he submitted his will to God's (referring to sacrifice of his
son)

He was promised the leadership of the world; he pleaded
for his progeny, and his prayer was granted, with the limitation
that if his progeny was false to God, God's promise did not reach
the people who proved themselves false.

as i said earlier if the shia ismaili imamat was fake then it would have ended just like all other shia branches.


What is the ismaili belief abou the Prophets, Messengers, and Imams?
Do Ismailis consider them divine?
Is the Ismaili belief about them closer to the mainstream Twelvers, or to the Nusayri, or to the Bahai?

shia ismailism is not a mixture of shia ishna shari,bahai or nusayri....shia ismailism is a religion that has been there since the day angel bowed down in front of h.adam[as]...we do not try to compare ourselves with other sister shia branches or sunni.

all the prophets,messengers and imams are divine or part of divine.


3. Do Ismailis believe the universe has an end?
Also, can you please tell me more about Ismaili cosmology and the Ismaili belief in cyclical time?

again as i said last time, its sunni's that believe that world is some thousand years old but islam has been perpetual right from the start...i.e way before h.adam[as] was created.

life started in water !!!!!

h.adam[as] was a man and not a fish

hope this helps you understand the concept of universe

[TheMaw]

1. What is a Pir? Is a Pir the same as a Prophet?

Just to clarify, it is a Persian word with basically the same meaning as Arabic shaykh does: "elder". In practice - as with shaykh - it has many meanings, even within Ismailism.

Aside from its usage in reference to "Imam & Pir" discussed above, it is also used to refer to al-Imaam al-Mustawda - those like Hassan ibn Ali who are *ranked* Imam but don't pass this on to their children.

It is also used to refer to honoured people, like the pirs of Sufism.

In short, it's a Persian term with a complicated use. Not all usage of pir adheres to a single standard in Ismailism because it has been used as freely as shaykh has in Arabic.

[ShamsB]

1. What is a Pir? Is a Pir the same as a Prophet?

Just to clarify, it is a Persian word with basically the same meaning as Arabic shaykh does: "elder". In practice - as with shaykh - it has many meanings, even within Ismailism.

Aside from its usage in reference to "Imam & Pir" discussed above, it is also used to refer to al-Imaam al-Mustawda - those like Hassan ibn Ali who are *ranked* Imam but don't pass this on to their children.

It is also used to refer to honoured people, like the pirs of Sufism.

In short, it's a Persian term with a complicated use. Not all usage of pir adheres to a single standard in Ismailism because it has been used as freely as shaykh has in Arabic.

Very well put and explained..especially the last paragraph. A term with a complicated use...

Shams

[From_Alamut]

Our Muslim brother/sister 'Someone2', feel free to ask as much question as you want until you gets all your question answered and I know that our humble Fadia Jamat will help you Inshallah.... at the same time I would suggest you to go please read this book online 'Introduction to Ismailism'
BY DR. SHEIKH KHODR HAMAWI
http://www.ismaili.net/Source/0583.html
I hope it also help you to answer all your questions..........

Kindness Regard

[kandani]

The following questions were posed by a Sunni Muslim in an Ismaili forum. We have tried to provide brief answers to these questions while referring readers to the appropriate source material for a comprehensive explanation.

Do Ismailis believe in a Day of Judgment?

Yes. The Day of Judgment has been discussed in many Ismaili texts. See for example the Da’aim al-Islam of al-Qadi al-Nu’man where the early Ismaili Imams mention the Day of Judgment.

Do Ismailis believe in Yugas?

Ismaili texts by the medieval Fatimid Ismaili theosophers such as Nasir-i Khusraw and al-Mu’ayyad fi’l-Din al-Shirazi speak about different cycles of time in human history. In Arabic these are referred to as dawr (plural: adwar). For an explanation of these cycles see the academic article by Dr. Shafique Virani, The Days of Creation in the Thought of Nasir Khusraw and Henry Corbin, Cyclical Time and Ismaili Gnosis.

Do Ismailis believe in reincarnation?

The concept of reincarnation was rejected by the Ismaili Imams and theosophers of the Fatimid period and Imam al-Muizz is said to have repudiated the concept. The Ismaili Ginans written after the 13th century mention the doctrine of rebirth – but as Aziz Esmail notes in his book A Scent of Sandlewood, the Ismaili Ginans evoke the doctrine of reincarnation but do not assert it. In other words, the Ginans refer to a belief in reincarnation which was already prevalent within the beliefs of the Indic religions and assimilate it into their religious symbolic framework.

Do Ismailis believe that the Imams are greater than Hazrat Muhammad (saw)?

The Ismailis believe that the Imams are the successors (awsiya) and inheritors of the knowledge and authority of the Prophet Muhammad. Nasir al-Din Tusi writes in his Paradise of Submission that Prophet Muhammad is unique and peerless in authority and nobility. The rank of Imamat is higher than the rank of Prophethood according to Imam Muhammad al-Baqir; but Prophet Muhammad was both a Prophet and an Imam.

Do ismailis believe in the Ginans literally?

The Ginans have been subject to a diversity of interpretations. Traditionally, texts such as the Ginans have not been interpreted literally.

In the Ginans it says that Hazrat Ali (ra) is Allah. Do Ismailis literally believe that he is Allah?

The Ginans refer to Hazrat Ali in with terms such as sahib (master), manifestation (avtar), king (shah), master (sami), etc. But this does not imply that Hazrat Ali is God Himself. Ismailis do not literally believe that Hazrat Ali (or any other Imam) is God Himself. At the Paris Conference which was held in the 1975, the Ismaili Imam defined the Imam as “the mazhar of God”. The term mazhar means “locus of manifestation” and does not mean that the Imam is equal to God – it implies a clear difference between the two. For more about the concept of mazhariyyah, see the book of Reza Shah-Kazemi, The Other in the Light of the One and Justice and Remembrance: Introducing the Spirituality of Imam ‘Ali (Chapter 3).

In Ismailism are the dietary restrictions the same as in Sunni Islam?

In common with Sunni Muslims, Ismaili Muslims are not to consume alcohol and pork. They also consume halal meat.

Do Ismailis have a kalma (declaration of faith)?

The Ismaili declaration of faith is:

La ilaha illa Allah
There is no god but God

Muhammadur-rasulillah
Muhammad is the Messenger of God

Aliyyun Amiru’l-Mumineen Aliyyullah
Ali, the Commander of the Faithful, is the Exalted of God

Do Ismailis consider the Ginans equal to the Holy Quran?

No, the Ismailis consider the Ginans to be the tafsir (commentary) and tawil (esoteric interpretation) of the Quran. This is as per a farman of Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah Aga Khan III, the 48th Ismaili Imam.

Is there an Ismaili hadith collection? \

There were Ismaili hadith collections in the past, but they have not survived to this day. However, the book of Qadi al-Numan – Da’aim al-Islam – does include many hadiths of the early Shi’a Imams.

What is the Ismaili belief about Hazrat Muhammad (saw) and Hazrat Ali (ra)?

Ismailis believe that the Prophet Muhammad and Imam ‘Ali shared a special spiritual closeness and intimacy by virtue of which Imam ‘Ali was the true successor of the Prophet. This is attested to both in generally accepted Islamic history and Prophetic hadiths. For example, ‘Ali was first named as the Prophet’s successor and deputy as a child when the Prophet performed his invitation to his near relatives. When the Muslims migrated from Mecca to Medina, the Prophet declared ‘Ali as his brother with the words “You are my brother in this world and the hereafter.” When the Prophet left on the Tabuk expedition, he left ‘Ali as his deputy and said: “Are you not satisfied that your station in relation to me is that of Harun to Moses, except that there shall be no prophet after me.” It is worth noting that the Quran states Harun to be the brother, helper (vizier), deputy (khalifa) and the one who shares in the authority (amr) of Moses. There are also several prophetic hadiths in both Sunni and Shia sources where the Prophet speaks of ‘Ali’s exalted status, such as: “Ali is from me and I am from him and he is the wali of every believer after me”; “I am the city of knowledge and Ali is its gate”; “To gaze upon Ali is ibadat”; “Ali and I are from one Light”; Finally, at the place of Ghadeer Khum as attested in both Shia and Sunni sources, the Prophet said about ‘Ali: “For whomsoever I am his mawla, this Ali is his mawla.”

What is the ismaili belief about the Prophets, Messengers, and Imams? Do Ismailis consider them divine?

Ismailis believe, as stated in the Quran, that God has sent thousands of Prophets and Messengers to all nations and communities in the world. Imam Sultan Muhammad Shah has named several of them in a chapter of his Memoirs. The Prophets/Messengers were not divine in themselves, but they were Divinely inspired and illumined by Divine Grace by which they were able to guide their communities on God’s command and behalf.

Do Ismailis believe the universe has an end?

Several Ismaili theosophers, particularly Nasir Khusraw have written that at a certain pint the Universe will come to an end. They call this the “Day of Resurrection” (yawm al-qiyamah). See the Wajh-i Din, Shis Fasl, and other Persian works of Nasir Khusraw.

[binom]

Someone2 asked:
Do Ismailis believe that the Imams are greater than Hazrat Muhammad (saw)?

Kandani wrote:
The Ismailis believe that the Imams are the successors (awsiya) and inheritors of the knowledge and authority of the Prophet Muhammad. Nasir al-Din Tusi writes in his Paradise of Submission that Prophet Muhammad is unique and peerless in authority and nobility. The rank of Imamat is higher than the rank of Prophethood according to Imam Muhammad al-Baqir; but Prophet Muhammad was both a Prophet and an Imam.

I say:
Can you provide me the source where Imam al-Baqir says this? As far as I know this is not a Twelver Shi’i belief but something that is a particular to Ismaili doctrine. Twelver Shi’i/Irfani belief is much closer, the same I would say, to Sunni/Sufi Islam’s conception of nubuwwah/wilayah and their relationship. In Shi’i Irfan and Sunni Sufism, The Prophet (saw) holds both offices while the Imams and the saints essentially hold only one. I say essentially because they partake of the Prophet’s nubuwwah only partially due to the spiritual transmission they receive from him through the nass/silsilah. That is why, for instance, they are able to introduce certain litanies alongside, as a sort complement for spiritual reasons, to the fundamentals of the Shariah (salat, etc), not to mention anything about the Tariqah, that the Prophet brought.

[kandani]

Dear sir,

The Twelver Shi'a and the Isma'ili Shi'a believe that the rank of Imamat is higher than the rank of Prophecy (nubuwwa). One source is a hadith attributed to Imam Muhammad al-Baqir found in the Shi'a hadith book Usul al-Kafi compiled by al-Kulayni. According hadith, the Imam referred to the appointment of Hazrat Ibrahim as an Imam in Quran verse 2:124 and said:


“Indeed, Allah made Abraham a servant (abd) before He made him a Prophet (nabi). He made him a Prophet before He made him a Messenger (rasul). He made him a Messenger before he made Him an Intimate (khalil). And He made him an Intimate before He made him an Imam. When Allah had granted him all these things and closed His Hand, it was only then He said: “Indeed, I am making you an Imam to the people”.

– Imam Muhammad al-Baqir, (al-Kulayni, Usul al-Kafi, Vol. 1, pp. 175)


Secondly, when one reads in the Qur'an, the Prophets such as Ibrahim, Ishaq and Yaqub were appointed as Imams after they had already been Prophets and Messengers.

Prophethood and Messengership pertain to the receipt and deliverance of God's Message to the people or communities, while Imamat involves the active leadership and interpretation and implementation of the Divine Message. The Imamat is an office that remains present even in periods when there are no Prophets.

The Prophet Muhammad held the offices of Nubuwwa, Risalah and Imamat. Mawlana Ali and the succeeding Imams hold the office of Imamat, but not Nubuwwa or Risalah. The station of Walayah (spiritual sanctity and divine proximity) pertains to the souls of the Prophet/Imams and it is something possessed by all of them - without the spiritual station of Walayah, one cannot be a Prophet, Messenger or an Imam.

[Rowonsadbarg]

Can you please reffer to a source where it mentions Hazrat Muhammad was an Imam

[kandani]

Regarding Hazrat Muhammad also being an Imam:

Nasir Khusraw states this in his Wajh-i Din and his section of the ta'wil of ablutions

There is also a letter of Imam 'Ali ibn Abi Talib preserved in a second century Shi'a source. This letter is quoted by Allamah Amini in a book called "al-Ghadir" on pages 67-71. In a portion of the letter, Imam 'Ali tells his opponent Mu'awiyah:

"You should know that we are the family of the Messenger of Allah (s). The unbeliever does not befriend us and the believer does not harbour our enmity in his heart. You have denied the Imamate of Muhammad (s) and you imagine that he is a Messenger and not an Imam. This denial leads you to deny the Imamate of all the Messengers. But we bear witness that he was a Messenger and an Imam."

[binom]

Dear sir,

The Twelver Shi'a and the Isma'ili Shi'a believe that the rank of Imamat is higher than the rank of Prophecy (nubuwwa). One source is a hadith attributed to Imam Muhammad al-Baqir found in the Shi'a hadith book Usul al-Kafi compiled by al-Kulayni. According hadith, the Imam referred to the appointment of Hazrat Ibrahim as an Imam in Quran verse 2:124 and said:


“Indeed, Allah made Abraham a servant (abd) before He made him a Prophet (nabi). He made him a Prophet before He made him a Messenger (rasul). He made him a Messenger before he made Him an Intimate (khalil). And He made him an Intimate before He made him an Imam. When Allah had granted him all these things and closed His Hand, it was only then He said: “Indeed, I am making you an Imam to the people”.

– Imam Muhammad al-Baqir, (al-Kulayni, Usul al-Kafi, Vol. 1, pp. 175)

Dear sir,

An important point that people often don't grasp needs to be made first. The Twelver Shi'i maintain that only the office of Imama is higher than that of Nubuwwa, not the person of the Imam himself. The person that is the Prophet, by virtue of being both a prophet and an imam, is ontologically higher in the hierarchy than the person that is the Imam. The Imam himself, again, is always below the Prophet, not in his function, but in his ontological reality. That is why for example in the Twelver Shi'i tradition the imams can never alter what the Prophet (saw) brought from God as regards not only the Shari'a but also, more importantly the Tariqa or 'Irfan (Twelver Shi'ism's inner dimension). Sufism, the inner dimesion of Sunni Islam, which often overlaps with the Twelver Shi'i esoteric tradition, more or less maintains the same thing, except that instead of the term Imama, Wilaya is used. Many Sufi saints have written about this, but, in particular, the shaykh al-akbar, Ibn 'Arabi (ra), anwered the matter conclusively when he wrote, "the Prophet's function as wali is more universal than his function as nabi". The wali is also, therefore, subordinate to the Prophet, not in his function as wali, but ontologically because the Prophet possesses both functions while the wali possesses only one of them. It can thus be said that the Prophet’s function as a prophet is below his function as an imam/wali. Anyway, there is much more to be said about this which I'm not able to do at the moment. However, for more on this issue, as it pertains to the Shi’i ‘Irfani tradition, consult the works of masters like Allama Tabatabai or, of course, you can also go straight to the works of the traditional masters as well whose books the former make easier to understand.

Secondly, when one reads in the Qur'an, the Prophets such as Ibrahim, Ishaq and Yaqub were appointed as Imams after they had already been Prophets and Messengers.

Prophethood and Messengership pertain to the receipt and deliverance of God's Message to the people or communities, while Imamat involves the active leadership and interpretation and implementation of the Divine Message. The Imamat is an office that remains present even in periods when there are no Prophets.

Prophethood and Messengership also involve the active leadership, interpretation and implementation of the Divine Message. This is what the Prophet (saw) did his whole life and which generations of Muslims try and follow. In what sense do Ismailis conceive the imam’s implementation/interpretation to be different from that of the Prophet’s?

[znanwalla]

binom says...

"An important point that people often don't grasp needs to be made first. The Twelver Shi'i maintain that only the office of Imama is higher than that of Nubuwwa, not the person of the Imam himself...."

Is anyone actually talking about physical forms or the "person" ? anyone who "worships" the physical forms of anyone, for the matter is an Idol worshipper !

The performance of light is to manifest. It is Allah who manifests the universe.

The human beings can only think of the factors of the spiritual world in terms of the phenomenal experience obtainable through physical senses; and in the phenomenal world light is the purest thing known to man.

Due to the limitations of human experience man cannot see the real light but perceive only the lighted objects. .

It is dependent upon some source external to itself...

The perfect light of Allah is free from any such defects. It prevails everywhere.

It envelops everything. It is independent of time and space. The niche (mishkat) is the recess in the wall, high from the ground in the house.

The divine light, according to the parable, is placed high above everything, all that which has been created, the whole universe.

The lamp is the core of the real illumination. It is placed inside a glass which protects it from any outside interference or disturbance

The illumination shines bright like a star. In this world, governed by the laws of cause and effect, it becomes natural to know what makes the lamp burn, as no lamp burns without oil.

So to give man the idea of a causative factor of the generation of light, it is said that the oil of the blessed tree of olive keeps the lamp alive.

It is said that after the great flood, the olive tree was the first to grow on the earth.

This mystic olive is not localised. It is neither of the east nor of the west. It is universal like the light of Allah.

The light of wisdom (the Quran) in the heart of the Holy Prophet and the Imams from his pure progeny is as protected as the lamp in the glass. Verses 77 to 79 of al Waqi-ah clearly state that the Quran is a protected book; and no one can touch it save the thoroughly purified, the Ahl ul Bayt, according to the verse 33 of Ahzab.

Therefore the true interpretation of "light upon light" is the Holy Prophet and his Ahl ul Bayt. It is further made clear in the next verse.

For "Allah guides whom He wills to His light" see the commentary of al Baqarah: 256 and 257- he who believes in Allah, indeed, has taken hold of the firmest handhold (or rope) which will not break off.

Allah brings them out of the darkness into light-It is obvious that those who are guided unto His light are the thoroughly purified ones.

They alone are the manifestations of the real light.

Those who follow these reflection of the divine light receive guidance from the grace of Allah to the extent or degree of their sincere attachment to them.

As also stated in the Quran, the divine attributes are divided into TWO groups namely the Jamali and the Jalali and so Naboowat represents the Jamali and the Imamat represents the Jalali aspects of the NUR.

In Chapter 68 of the Holy Quran the words NOON WAL QALAM (INK & the PEN are attributed to the Naboowat and Imamat respectively).

And BOTH are related to KNOWLEDGE ! There is a famous hadith of the Prophet (pbuh):.." I am the City of Knowledge...Ali is the gate..."

Again in chapter 91 the words SUN & MOON is attributed to Naboowat and Imamat. Mir Ahmad Ali in his commentary also concurs on this.

BOTH Naboowat and Imamat are "manifestations" of Allah's Love. Allah is the creator of Love and HE is the most loving...the attributes of Love, are expressed through "Reh'matu lil Aalimeen" and also at a lower level through the Parents.

Qalam and Pen have been mentioned with LOH - Kindly read Sura 43.

In chapter 21 the Prophet has been referred to as a Mercy for all worlds...and so Allah personified HIS Mercy through Muhamad SAW.

Nabi receives the Quran ....Imam speaks the Quran !

Nabi shows the Truth...the Imam possesses it !

The Prophet did say..." where there is Ali...there is Truth.."

Once when Mowla Ali was asked about his relationship with the Prophet, he said..

" I am related to Ahmad just as a LIGHT is related to LIGHT..." and so Naboowat and Imamat are TWO sides of the same coin.."

Sermon 1 - Amir ul Mo'mineen - Ali ibn Talib

"..OR there are those verses (in the Book) which are obligatory in a GIVEN TIME BUT not SO AFTER THAT TIME.

It's prohibitions also differ. Some are MAJOR regarding which there exists the threat of Hell and others are minor for which there are prospects of Forgiveness.

There are also those of which a small portion is also acceptable to Allah but they are capable of being expanded..."

Amir ul Momineen

Sermon 1 - Amir ul Mo'mineen - Ali ibn Talib

"..The Prophet of Islam left among you the same which other Prophets left among their peoples because prophets do not leave them intentionally in dark without a clear path and a "standing ensign",namely the BOOK clarifying its permission and prohibitions; its obligations and discretion; its repealing injunctions and the repealed ones; its permissible matters and compulsory ones.."

Why did the people then create their own texts and reject what the Prophet had left with Hazrat Ali?

Sermon 1 - Amir ul Mo'mineen - Ali ibn Talib

"..The Prophet of Islam left among you the Book.... its lessons and illustrations; its long and the short ones; its clear and obscure ones; detailing its abbreviations and clarifying its obscurities.

The correct guidance now comes from the Imams of the Ahl al Bayt,who have the sacred knowledge of the Tawil.

They know the Zahir and the Batin...Allah has purified them so as to touch the recitations !

Amir ul Momineen describes members of his own family:...

" They are the life and death for ignorance" Then Imam Ali says:

" Their forbearnace tells you of their knowledge and their silence of their wisdom; they do not go against right nor do they differ among themselves.."

4:[56] Those who reject Our Signs, We shall soon cast into the Fire; as often as their skins are roasted through, We shall change them for fresh skins, that they may taste the Penalty: for Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise.

[znanwalla]

In Ehtijaj-e-Tabrasi, which is among the most reliable books of the Shias a saying of the ninth Imam, Mohammad bin Ali bin Musa, has been reproduced which says about the Last Imam that:

“One of the unique things about him will be that his birth will take place secretly and people will not know about it and he will not be visible to people. From the four corners of the world three hundred and thirteen companions will gather round him, exactly equal to the number of Muslims who fought in the Battle of Badr.

When 313 earnest and devoted persons will collect round him, God will reveal the Imam i.e., he will come out of the cave and begin his mission.

It is significant that the appearance of the Absent Imam having not taken place as yet in light of the saying of Imam Mohammad bin Ali bin Musa,would it be reasonable to then conclude atleast that during all these eleven hundred and fifty years since 260 A.H., 313 truthful and sincere Shias in the mainstream have not been available who could stand up for the Absent Imam, otherwise he would have, surely, emerged from the cave.

What do you think? It is worth asking whether Shia leaders and theologians like you hold the same view or not.

If the Almighty has not left the organs of man's body without the guidance of the mind, how is it possible that Almighty God could leave millions of His creatures without an IMAM to guide and solve their problems arising out of doubts and conflicts? All Sh'ias agree on the need for an "infallible guide" - the scholars and mutjahids are fallible ! so what do you have to say Sir ?

Should not our common sense accept this fact?

[kandani]

"An important point that people often don't grasp needs to be made first. The Twelver Shi'i maintain that only the office of Imama is higher than that of Nubuwwa, not the person of the Imam himself. The person that is the Prophet, by virtue of being both a prophet and an imam, is ontologically higher in the hierarchy than the person that is the Imam. The Imam himself, again, is always below the Prophet, not in his function, but in his ontological reality."

This is where Isma'ili thought differs.

The persons of the Imams are at the same ontological level as the person of the Prophet. they differ in function because the Imam is not a prophet therefore he does not receive revelation and does not bring a scripture.

But the Imam has the same authority as the Prophet in terms of specifiying religous practices, making authoritative judgments, purifying the beleivers, interceeding for their forgiveness, and instructing them in knowledge and wisdom.

Ontologically speaking, the soul of the Prophet Muhammad and the souls of the Shi'a Imams are loci of manifestation (mazahir) of the same Light (nur).

[znanwalla]

Makes sense !

“Once Hazrat Jaabir (radi Allahu anhu) asked the Holy Prophet (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) whom Allah Ta'ala created before anything else.

The Holy Prophet Muhammad (sallal laahu alaihi wasallam) stated: "O Jaabir! Verily, before the creation of anything else Almighty Allah created the Noor of your Nabi from His Noor." (Muwahibul Laduniya; Zirkani Shareef)”

Relationship of Ali with the prophet is that of Light with Light itself...the current is just the same....any deviation therefrom based on forms,means Shirk

[binom]

Ontologically speaking, the soul of the Prophet Muhammad and the souls of the Shi'a Imams are loci of manifestation (mazahir) of the same Light (nur).

Ontologically speaking, the souls of all men and, ultimately, of all things in creation, are loci of manifestion of the same Light. However, that Light manifests itself in various degress in each individual soul and thing in accordance with its isti'dad. It does not manifest itself to the same extent in all souls and things. The degree to which that Light manifests itself in my soul is far far less than the degree to which it manifests itself in the souls of saints like Rumi and Hafiz or sages like Plotinus and Ibn Sina. The pinnicale of its manifestion is in the soul of the Prophet (saw) and all others come after. The question of degree and extent, therefore, must always be considered.

[kandani]

"However, that Light manifests itself in various degress in each individual soul and thing in accordance with its isti'dad. It does not manifest itself to the same extent in all souls and things. The degree to which that Light manifests itself in my soul is far far less than the degree to which it manifests itself in the souls of saints like Rumi and Hafiz or sages like Plotinus and Ibn Sina. The pinnicale of its manifestion is in the soul of the Prophet (saw) and all others come after. The question of degree and extent, therefore, must always be considered."

Yes sir, you are right and I did not mean to ignore the concept of the soul's capacity and degree of preparedness.

With reference to the soul of Prophet Muhammad in Ismaili thought, the following quote of Nasir al-Din Tusi is pertinent:

"Muhammad the Chosen was a grand spiritual compendium, unifying in himself both the terminus of those signs and the commencement of those illuminations [which had graced the progeny of our lord Ishmael]. He was thus unique, without peer in authority, prophethood, majesty and statesmanship, pre-eminent both in the spirituality of his words and physical conduct." (The Paradise of Submission, p. 137)

You do not find a clearcut answer in ismaili thought as to which soul - that of the Prophet or Imam - possesses higher ontological status. Different sources from different periods articulate various views.

[znanwalla]

After muhammad's (SAW) passing, a group of visitors went to his widow, Aisha. They asked her, "What was the Prophet, God's Messenger, like? "Have you read the Koran?"

She replied. He was the living Koran.

In Jange Sifin Ali (As) said the same thing i.e. he was Qur'an E Natikq; the Book (Qur'an) was Samit. All Shia's accept this. Now tell us what did Ali (AS) mean by what he said ?

Abdul Qadir al-Jilani (Essential Sufism): God said, through the Prophet, "Man is my secret and I am his secret.

The inner knowledge of the spiritual essence is a secret of My secrets.

Only I put this into the heart of My good servant, and none may know his state other than Me."..

The Prophet used to make Ali (AS) sleep on his chest each night and he used to take something from his mouth and put it into Ali's mouth who was a child then....at the family feast the Prophet said..."Ali is my brother,heir and my successor....."Ali's flesh is my flesh"

Rumi: It is necessary to have a guide for the spiritual journey. Choose a master, for without one this journey is full if trials, fears, and dangers.

With no esort, you would be lost on a road you have already taken.

Do not travel alon the Path. Whoever travels without a guide needs two hundred years for a two-day journey.

Source: Al-Ghazzali and the Ismailis by Farouk Mitha

So what purpose can a "hidden" Imam serve?

If Ali (As) inherited all the authority of the Prophet and was his legitimate successor, the issue of "ontological superiority" vis a vis each other becomes a moot point...the relationship of Ali (AS) to the Prophet is the same relationship of Light with Light....the AMR originates from the same NUR !

Obedience to Ali of the time and age is obedience to the Prophet and obedience to them both is obedience to Allah ! This is the means "Al-Wasila"

Obedience to Mullahs and Muftis and scholars is haram ! show me where it is sanctioned in the quran?

According to al-Shahrastani's version the doctrine of talim, in every age, maintains that religious authority resides in, and is disseminated by, one uniquely qualified teacher whose legitimacy demands no extrinsic proof other than the need of mankind for such a teacher.

Hence every individual has to seek out and commit himself unconditionally to this teacher.

The complete autonomy of the teacher implies that the role of individual reasoning in pursuing the truth is, of necessity, subordinated to the authority of this teacher.

Undue refutations of the position of such a teacher is just an exercise in futility as there does exist overwhelming and neutral grounding in the quran and the ahadith in support of Imamat and also, in pursuing the Truth.

Marshall Hodgson and W. Montgomery Watt have argued that al-Ghazali did not so much reject the premises of the ta'lim doctrine but adapted them to the needs and situation of the Sunni community.

The Twelver Sh'ia scholars are in disagreement with each other over almost everything except perhaps Muta.

Al-Ghazzali's turning towards Sufism, which was to begin in earnest very soon after he had written the K. Al-Mustazhiri, is perhaps the most articulate expression of his individualistic temperament, leading him to withdraw from the life of the community in order to pursue the dictates of his own personal conscience.

Marshall Hodgson and Henri Laoust have both argued that the stirrings of what later developed into al-Ghazali's existentialist posture (with the emphasis on religious experience) can be traced back to his engagement with the ta'lim doctrine, especially since the ta'lim doctrine, as much as al Ghazali would wish it to be underplayed, culminated in an act of existential commitment to, and dependence on, the teacher.

This interpretation brings to light one of the most fascinating ironies in Muslim intellectual history: that al Ghazali's intellectual reformation of Sunni Islam was in large part shaped by the ideas and ethos of the Shi'a Ismaili doctrine of ta'lim.

Sunnis need to re think things and the Sh'ias need to explain how they can rely on a hidden teacher because Qazi Noman's family, Hasan bin-Sabah, Nasir Khusraw, al Tusi, were all followers of 12 Imams but they could no longer wait for the return and went in search of the True Imam and their search led them to the Fatimid Imams.....

[znanwalla]

lmam Ja’far as-Sadiq said to a questioner:

“Know that none among the earlier communities in times gone by, nor among people that are no more, nor have we heard tell of any folk, that any of them were greater in wrong-doing than this community.

For, verily they assert that there is nothing to distinguish them from the members of the House of their Prophet, and that the Ahl al-Bayt are not more excellent than the commonalty.

Now he who makes such an assertion is surely a greater imposter in the eyes of God and is guilty of a grave slander and a manifest crime.

By this affirmation he is quit of Muhammad or the family of Muhammad until he repents and returns to the true faith by acknowledging the excellence of those on whom it has been bestowed by the Glorious and Almighty God among the members of the House of Prophecy, the Abode of Mercy, the Mine of Knowledge, the People of the Reminder, the Coevals of Angels.

Now he who asserts that even by these attributes there is no excellence in them is entirely repudiated by the Ahl al-Bayt in this world and the hereafter.”

When asked by a questioner, ‘Give me a proof from the Book of God to establish the dictum that the ‘progeny’ of Muhammad are specifically the members of his house, as distinguished from others’, the Imam replied:

“Very well, God, and He is the most truthful of speakers, said: ‘Lo! God preferred Adam and Nuh and the family of Ibrahim and the family of Imran above all his creatures.”

And then the Imam clarified who the people were that were thus chosen and said:

“They were descendants one of another; and God is Hearer and Knower. ‘And it is impossible to be of the progeny of the Prophet except through direct descent’.”[

Imam Ja’far as-Sadiq has thus unequivocally declared that only the progeny of Prophet Muhammad through direct descent are the Ahl al-Bayt.


We shall now elaborate on this through ayats of the Holy Qur’an, supplemented with historical accounts and the hadith of the Prophet Muhammad.

The Famous Incident of Mubahala (The Contest of Prayer to God)
If anyone disputes with you concerning him (Jesus), after knowledge has been given to you, say (unto them, O Muhammad)! ‘Come, let us call our sons and your sons, our women and your women, and ourselves and yourselves. Then let us call on God to witness against each other and let us make the curse of God fall on those who lie. Holy Qur’an, Sura 3, Ayat 61

The above verse was revealed to the Prophet in Mecca in 10 A.H. (631-632 CE) which led to the famous event recorded in history as Mubahala (contest of prayer to God) with the Christians.

A delegation of sixty Christians from Najran, led by their Chief Priest Abd al-Masih, came to Prophet Muhammad and asked him about his views about Jesus, to which he replied: “Jesus is the servant of God.”

And when they discussed with him about the status and personality of Jesus in view of his miraculous birth, God sent a revelation to the Prophet which said:

“The likeness of Jesus in the sight of God is like the likeness of Adam. God created him from dust.

Then God said to him ‘Be’ and he was. That is the truth from your Lord. Therefore do not be one of those who doubt.” (Sura 3, Ayats 59,60)

In spite of this revelation, which likened Jesus to Adam, the Christians continued to dispute and hence, the Qur’anic verse (3:61), mentioned above, called upon the Prophet to invite the Christians to settle the dispute by Mubahala.

The Christians consulted amongst themselves and finally agreed to come for the Mubahala early next morning.

Before the break of dawn, Prophet Muhammad sent one of his closest companions, Salman al-Farsi, to an open place to erect a small shelter for himself and for those whom he intended to take with him to the contest.

At the appointed hour, the Christians witnessed the arrival of the Prophet with Husayn in his arms, Hasan holding his finger and walking beside him, Bibi Fatima following him, and Hazrat Ali behind her.

Reaching the appointed spot, the Holy Prophet stationed himself with his daughter, his two grandsons and his cousin and son-in-law Hazrat Ali for the contest.

Raising his hands to heaven, he said: “O Lord! these are the People of my House.”

The Chief Priest inquired about those who were accompanying the Prophet and when he was told who they were, he addressed his fellow Christians and said:

“Have you seen that he has come with the special members of his family so that he may make the contest of prayer with them, trusting in his truthfulness.

By God! he would not have come with them if he was afraid that the proof would be against him.

Therefore, be warned against the contest of prayer with him. By God! if it was not for the position of Caesar (the Byzantine emperor), I would submit to him. But (now) make peace with him on what can be agreed between you and him.

Return to your land and think about it yourselves.”

The Christians readily accepted the advice counselled by their leader, who then went to the Prophet and said:

“We will not have the Mubalala, but we will make peace with you.”

This historical event has a great significance with regard to what it discloses about those who accompanied the Holy Prophet to the Mubahala.

God’s command in this verse, regarding each kind of relative to be summoned for the event, is in the plural, i.e. to call the sons, women and the selves to invoke His curse on the liars, but the Holy Prophet took only his two grandchildren whereas there were innumerable other children amongst his followers, he took only one lady, his daughter, whereas there were nine other ladies in his own household who were his wives, among whom were the daughters of Abu Baqr and also of Umar, and he took only his cousin and son-in-law Hazrat Ali with him, whereas there were others who were also his companions.

This choice of the Holy Prophet clearly shows that there were no other members among the children and women or the adults to be compared to these members of his household in their personal purity and holiness.

It was unquestionably and firmly established before the huge crowds of Muslims, as well as the non-Muslims to bear witness that only the Holy Prophet, his daughter Fatima, his grandsons Hasan and Husayn and his cousin and son-in-law Ali b. Abi Talib are the Ahl al-Bayt and no one else.

The Protection of the Prophet’s Family under his Mantle

“.. And God’s wish is but to remove (every kind of) impurity from you, O People of the House and purify you (with) a thorough purification.” Holy Qur’an, Sura 33, Ayat 33

Amr Ibn Abi Salma, who was brought up by the Holy Prophet, relates:

“When this verse was revealed, the Holy Prophet was in the House of Umme-Salema.

At the revelation of the above verse, the Holy Prophet assembled his daughter Fatima, her sons Hasan and Husayn, and her husband, his cousin Ali and covered the group including himself with his own mantle and addressing God said:

‘O God! these constitute my progeny. Keep them away from every kind of impurity, purified with perfect purification.’

Umme-Salema, the righteous wife of the Holy Prophet, witnessing this marvellous occasion, humbly submitted to the Holy Prophet:

‘O Apostle of God! May I also join the group?’ to which the Holy Prophet replied ‘No, remain in your own place. You are in goodness’.”

According to Sahih Sitta, which is the consolidation of sound prophetic traditions from six authentic collections, Umme-Salema said:

“I also caught hold of a corner of the mantle and wanted to get under it, but the Holy Prophet snatched it away from me and said, ‘You are in goodness but not of the Ahl al-Bayt.”


It is historically acknowledged that the Qur’anic verse (33:33), which was revealed once in the house of Umme-Salema, was repeated again in the house of Ayesha.

Ayesha reports that one day, when the Holy Prophet was enwrapped in a black mantle, there came to him his grandson Hasan and the Holy Prophet got him under the mantle.

Then came Husayn (the other grandson) and he was also received in the similar manner by the Holy Prophet under the mantle.

When came his daughter Fatima, the Holy Prophet took her under the mantle.

In came Ali and the Holy Prophet also received him under the mantle, and then the Holy Prophet recited the above mentioned verse of Tatheer, i.e. purification.

It could reasonably be said that the revelation of one and the same verse in the houses of two of the wives of the Holy Prophet was the divine plan to declare the exclusive position of the Ahl al-Bayt and that both the wives should bear witness to the event.

Thus they could vouch for their exclusion from the Ahl al-Bayt and that any votaries, on behalf of the wives of the Holy Prophet, may not later attempt to include the wives in the term.

There is not a single tradition to show that the Holy Prophet considered the wives to have been included in the understanding of the verse 33:33.

Some of the modern commentators have attempted to distort the phrase Allahumma Hawla’i, i.e. ‘O Lord! these are the People of my House’ as to mean ‘O Lord! these also are the People of my House ’.

Ibn Kathir a noted Sunni commentator, in his tafseer of the above ayat (33:33), writes that Ibn Hambal and Tirmizi have written that when the Prophet used to go for the morning prayers, he would pass by the door of Hazrat Bibi Fatima’s house. At that time he would say: “O Ahl al-Bayt! It is time for the salat.” He would then recite the above ayat (33:33). [7]

Ayesha, while going to the battle of Jamal, was asked about Ali ibn Abi Talib.

Ayesha replied:

“You ask me about the one whom the Holy Prophet loved the most? By God! I saw the Holy Prophet taking Ali, Fatima, Hasan and Husayn under his mantle and saying:

‘O God! These and only these are my Ahl al-Bayt. Keep them away from every impurity’.

I asked the Holy Prophet: ‘Am I not of your Ahl al-Bayt?’

The Holy Prophet said, ‘No, you are not of my Ahl al-Bayt’.”

It was asked of Zahid Bin Arqam as to who constitute the Ahl al-Bayt, and if the wives are also included in them.

The reply was that a wife is associated as long as the wedlock continues or the husband lives.

If divorced or widowed the wife returns to her parents. The Ahl al-Bayt are those whose relationship is unbreakable or unceasable with the Holy Prophet.

The Verse Concerning the Special Blessings for the Prophet

Verily God and his angels bless the Prophet: O ye who believe! Send your blessings on him and greet him with a worthy salutation. Holy Qur’an, Sura 33, Ayat 56

When this verse was revealed, some of the companions of the Prophet asked him about it and said:

“O messenger of God, we know how to greet you, but how are we to bless you?”

And the Prophet said,

“You should say ‘O God bless the Prophet and his Progeny, even as you had blessed Abraham and his Progeny. Verily: You (O God) are worthy of praise, full of Majesty’.”

In this way, the Prophet clarified to them how to send blessings made obligatory by God, and made clear that the blessings are for him and for his progeny.

The above verse states that God and His Angels send their blessings to the Holy Prophet.

The Holy Prophet’s inclusion of his progeny along with him in the recitation of the Salawat was perfectly justified in that his Aal, that is his progeny, is one with him in purity and personal grace (33:33).

To associate anybody else with the Aal will be an unwarranted and unacceptable fancy of the one who does it.

For none else could ever be aligned with those purified by God himself.

Love for the Prophet’s Kith and Kin

That is of which God gives the glad tidings unto His servants who believe and do good deeds.

‘Say(O Muhammad! to mankind), I demand not of you any recompense for it (the toils of apostleship): save the love of (my) relatives. And whosoever earns good, we increase for him good therein, veril

y God is oft-Forgiving, the Appreciator (of good)’. Sura 42, Ayat 23
The Shi ‘a ulama say that once a group of people came to the Prophet saying:

“O Prophet of God, you came to us at the time when we had lost the way. God guided us through you. We were poor, God made us rich through you. Our wealth is at your disposal. Take from it what ever you like.”

It was on this occasion, say the learned from amongst the Shia’s, that the above verse relating to the love for the relatives was revealed.

The Qur’anic expression, ‘the love for the relatives’ according to them means the love for ‘All, Fatima, Hasan, Husayn and their descendants.

Their opponents who do not approve of this explanation maintain that the above verse has been cancelled by another verse in the Qur’an which runs thus:

“Say, whatever I ask you regarding my return, it is for you; I depend for my reward on none but God and he is a witness to everything.”

The Shia’s refute this argument by saying that the second verse which has been quoted by their opponents and which according to them has a nullifying effect on the first one was either revealed before the first verse, (‘I demand not of you any recompense for it, save the love of my relatives’) or after it. If it was revealed before the verse which asks the believers to love the Prophet’s relatives (42:23) then it cannot cancel it.

On the other hand, if it was revealed after the verse pertaining to ‘the love for the relatives’, it makes the first verse all the more emphatic. For the verse:

‘Say, whatever I ask you in the way of return, is meant for you’,

means that the love for the relatives of the Prophet which he asked for from the believers is really for their benefit, in this that God will be pleased with them.

This is corroborated by the saying of Imam Ja’far-as Sadiq which is as follows:

“If a servant of God was to worship Him between the rukn and the muqam in the Ka’ba until his physical body begins to dissolve, his devotion will not be recognised by God if he does not approach him through us.”

The verse is clear in its meaning that the Holy Prophet is being commanded by God to ask the believers to love his kith and kin, i.e. the Holy Ahl al-Bayt and that would be in return for his Apostolic services.

This command has a very wide and extensive meaning which tells the Muslims that if they wished to pay the return for the Prophet’s service, and be always on the right path, they should follow his Ahl al-Bayt, for these are the ones whom God has himself purified (33:33), these are the truthful ones and the custodian of the original Word of God and its correct interpretation.

When the Messenger of God was asked as to who were his kith and kin, he replied:

“Ali, Fatima, Hasan and Husayn.”

He further stated:

“He who loves them, loves me. He who hates them, hates me. None but a mumin loves Ali and none but a hypocrite hates Me.”

It is said that in the days of the Prophet, mu’mins could not be distinguished from the hypocrites by anything, but their love for Ali.

The Prophet ordained and exhorted his followers to love Ali, and God enjoined it as a duty on the Muslims in general.

Imam Muhammad al-Baqir was asked to explain the meaning of the above verse (42:23). He explained it by saying,

“It is the duty of every mumin to love us who are the Ahl al-Bayt, the kith and kin of Muhammad.”

He further said, “He who loves us will again rise with us on the Day of Judgement.” Again he said: “Religion is nothing but love.” God says: “He made you love your faith and adorned it in your hearts.” (49:7) [11]

In conclusion, the Ahl al-Bayt are the progeny of the Holy Prophet by direct descent, his kith and kin.

Thus only the Panjetan Pak - the five holy ones - protected under the mantle of the Prophet Muhammad and the progeny of the Prophet Muhammad by direct descent, that is the rightful Imams including the Imam-e-Zaman, are the Ahl al-Bayt.

[From_Alamut]

YA 'ALI` M A D A D

WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SHIA ISMAILSM ESOTERIC AND SUFISM? ARE ISMAILIS SUFI?

In my understanding, YES Ismailis Shia are Sufis, but Sufis are not Ismaili........

[znanwalla]

Sufi scholars will inter act and dialogue or discuss with Ismaili scholars but chances are that they may not bother to engage others on inter related subjects....

To whomsoever the Master shows even an iota of knowledge of Allah
(Ma'rifah), his inner self realises the Truth and attains its origin.

But the one who loses this knowledge in his heart has indeed lost his
Lord.

Listen to this advice, understand it and always ponder upon it.
The Mawla(Hazarat Aly) commends this of everybody.

"The period of Imam Mohammad Bakir (d. 114/733) and Imam Jafar Sadik (d. 148/765) saw a complete growth of the Shi’ism in Islam, therefore, the followers were imparted the doctrine of the Imamate and other tenants of Islam , which distinguished them from the orthodox Sunni Muslims.

Hence, the Shia and Sunni differed with each other in the interpretation of religious aspects..."

....the Sunni theologians had turned the Shariah into formalistic ritualism, and hence their adherents were known as Ashab al-Zahir ..."

[binom]

Different sources from different periods articulate various views.

Who are these different sources? The Ismaili scholars?

[znanwalla]

Binom, Which madrassa did you go to? in the city or in the slums? Tell me who you are and I will show you where you belong to which sty - the one that reads the opium gazette or the wahabbi chronicle ? don't you understand that you guys are well known for sweeping under the carpet what does not suit your cult notwithstanding whether it is a Sunni or Sh'ia reference given or even the quran itself - maybe you don't want to know how you betrayed the Prophet and fell into misguidance and so you like to play out your gift of thje gab and offer twisted versions to sound as if we have no access to any other sources? do you think we are backward and pagans?....now hold yourself out in good faith - tell me which cult you come from and then I will be happy to take you on a ride with me...or keep your snide remarks to yourself ....to any sensible person 'different sources" (whoever said that) is quite clear except to those whose education begins and ends at a madrassa.

[kmaherali]

YA 'ALI` M A D A D

WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SHIA ISMAILSM ESOTERIC AND SUFISM? ARE ISMAILIS SUFI?

In my understanding, YES Ismailis Shia are Sufis, but Sufis are not Ismaili........

Yes SHia Ismailis are Sufis, but not all Sufis are Ismailis directly since they are not murids of MHI. However most of the silsilas (chains) of Sufi masters begin with Hazarat Ali and hence indirectly they are connected to the Noor of Hazarat Ali.

MSMS in the famous Usul-e-Din Farman states:

"You should set your heart on Sufism (mysticism). You should aim at reaching even further. Sufism is Tariqat (the Path) for you, it will lead to Haqiqat (Truth). The Spirit enriched by knowledge will rise higher, step by step. But one who lacks the inner knowledge will complacently stay where he is."

Cyrill Glasse in his The Concise Encyclopaedia of Islam states:

"Sufism is the science of the direct knowledge of God; its doctrines and methods are derived from the Koran and Islamic revelation. Like exoteric Islam, Sufism freely makes use of paradigms and concepts derived from Greek and even from Hindu sources…."

Hence Sufism is a Path with a method on the one hand and a coherent system of knowledge and metaphysics linking Creation to the Creator and our role and purpose in it on the other, which will lead towards the knowledge of God. Ismailism does satisfy the criteria; for example Sayyed Nasr in one of his interview with the Parabola magazine quotes the ideas of Ikhwan as-Safa, the Brethren of Purity which connect man and creation via the consciousness and the Divine Intellect. Below is an excerpt from the interview.

P: In An Introduction to Islamic Cosmological Doctrines, you write about the Ikhwan as-Safa, the Brethren of Purity, and you mention their belief that "the intellect gives life to the sun and the moon." That raises the question of whether human consciousness is somehow essential to the activity of the higher spheres. Do they only work on us, or do we also have an effect on them?

SHN:The Divine Intellect has an effect on both. If you try to answer this question a la Cartesian dualism, which is the background of all modern thought unless you consciously get out of it, you have a world out there and a subject here which has consciousness. Somehow this subject comes to know the world out there. We don't know how; ever since Descartes posited his dualism, nobody has known how this takes place, and so you find many forms of materialism and idealism, which are two sides of the same coin. This is one of the interesting points in contemporary physics. Physicists say now that there is no physics without consciousness. Consciousness is part of the structure of physical reality. With that in mind, if we can get rid of this three-hundred-year heritage of Cartesian dualism, we can answer your question in a much more profound way. When the Brethren of Purity say that the Divine Intellect is the life of the sun and moon, they're speaking from within a universe in which there is no absolute division between what we call physical light and the divine light. They are grades of the same reality, which goes from the physical to the psychological to the spiritual to the divine. Since these two bodies reflect light upon the world, they must receive their light from the Divine Intellect, the source of all light according to the tradition of Islamic cosmology.

According to this perspective, our consciousness is also derived from the same light. Human consciousness is an incredible thing, and the most direct proof of the non-physical nature of our existence. We don't need any other proof for the existence of God than to understand human subjectivity. Our consciousness also comes from that Divine Intellect; if there were no Divine Consciousness, there would be no human consciousness. Seen in this light, if our consciousness did not exist, the Divine Consciousness would still exist, but the polarization of reality into the microcosm and the macrocosm would not. The metacosmic reality is refracted and polarized in the world of creation into the macrocosm and the microcosm, so they are in a sense the complements of each other. It is impossible to understand, in terms of modern science, that there would be no universe if there were no man. This sounds absurd. We are talking about a little speck of dust in cosmic space which is called the earth, itself just an accident, and on that earth there are even smaller specks which are called human beings. That it is these very small specks who are saying these things is forgotten, as well as the fact that these "specks" can hold the knowledge of these galaxies.

P: Consciousness seems to be the essential glue.

SHN: Exactly. There is no knowledge without adequation. There must be a correspondence between the knower and the known in order for the knower to know the known. If we can know the whole of the vast galactic space that means that something in our consciousness corresponds to that reality to make that knowledge possible. You cannot have one half of a syzygy, something which is comprised of two complementary parts, and remove one part without the other part being removed. It's like holding something before a mirror and having a mirror image on the other side; once you remove the object, the image is also gone. If you really understand that, you can say that if there were no human consciousness, there would be no sun and moon.

Hence one can say that the elevation of the consciousness through the purification of heart is the essence of Sufism. The focus is on inner purification and not the external show of it. One can live a normal life with all the material blessings around and yet be a Sufi. The key is non-attachment to the external objects; they should not be a distraction to the essential purpose. Ethics also play a vital role in the purification process and hence an ethical life regardless of the kind of occupation is important.

In the Ginan Jogi so Jogi, Pir Hassan Kabirdeen highlights the distinction between false yogis who make a show of their asceticism from the real and true yogis.

39) JOGI SO JUGAA JUGA JOGI BY PEER HASSAN KABEERDEEN 90

jogi so jo jugaa jug jogi, avar so mu(n)draa dhaari re jogi

ejee kanaka keri mu(n)draa jogi dagamag dole
manaki mu(n)draa saari re jogi...............................1

jogi so jo jugaa jug jogi, avar so mu(n)draa dhaari re jogi

A true devotee(ascetic) is he who is always a devotee,
Others are only the wearers of earrings (a symbol of a devotee).
O devotee! The earrings of gold dangle in the ears(to make show of your being a devotee),
But a better earring ( symbol of a devotee) is a(sincere) mind, O devotee!
A true devotee (ascetic) is he, who is always a devotee,
Others are only the wearers of earrings (a symbol of devotee).


man meri mu(n)draa tan sarovar kaayaa
andar bhabhut lagaayaa re jogi....................................2
jogi so jo jugaa jug jogi

My (sincere) mind is the earring; my body is the lake,
Within me I have applied the ash (a symbol of renouncement of the world), i.e. I have renounced the world from within my heart, O devotee!
A true devotee (ascetic) is he who is always a devotee.


kaachi kaayaa pavan aadhaari
jesi neer bharee paari re jogi....................................3
jogi so jo jugaa jug jogi

The frail body depends on the breathes (of life),
It is like the water filled in an earthen vessel, O devotee!
A true devotee (ascetic) is he who is always a devotee.


paari re bhagasi sab neer dhulannaa
e pind kuchh kaam na karaa re jogi................................4
jogi so jo jugaa jug jogi

When the vessel breaks all the water will flow away
This body has done nothing, O devotee!
A true devotee (ascetic) is he who is always a devotee.


cheto cheto munivar mere bhaai
ayi hai paap kha(n)data keri vaari re jogi........................5
jogi so jo jugaa jug jogi

Beware, beware, O great devotee and my brother!
The time has come when you must destroy all sins, O devotee!
A true devotee (ascetic) is he who is always a devotee.


hasa(n)taa khela(n)taa shaah nagarime aayaa
so jogi jenne jug moyaare jogi....................................6
jogi so jo jugaa jug jogi

Smilingly and playfully, the Lord entered the city (heart of a devotee), he is the same Ascetic who has fascinated the world, O devotee!


ginaan mahaaras bhanne peer hasan kabeerdeen
dashame hai asavaari re jogi......................................7
jogi so jo jugaa jug jogi, avar so mu(n)draa dhaari re jogi

Pir Hassan Kabirdin says in this ginaan which is pregnant with meaning: "It is in this period (of Imamat) that the Lord will ride and proclaim (his spiritual rule over the world)".
A true devotee (ascetic) is he who is always a devotee,
Others are only the wearers of earrings (a symbol of devotee)

[binom]

Yes SHia Ismailis are Sufis, but not all Sufis are Ismailis…

Kmarherali,

Sufi scholars don’t even accept you (Ismailis) as orthodox let alone consider you to be practitioners of authentic Tasawwuf. The problem here, as I see it, is that you seem to treat Sufism as if it was independent from orthodox Sunni Islam. That is completely false, however; the majority of Sufi scholars, both past and present, were/are for the most part Sunnis (although there were/are Twelver Shi’i Sufis as well). They therefore practiced Tasawwuf in the context of either Sunni or Shia (Twelver) Islam. In the latter, though, it is known not as Sufism but ‘Irfan.

However most of the silsilas (chains) of Sufi masters begin with Hazarat Ali and hence indirectly they are connected to the Noor of Hazarat Ali.

Sufis, through the silsilah, are connected directly to God through the Prophet (saw), to whom they are connected through Imam Ali (as) and so on. The purpose of the chain is connection to God, not the noor of Ali.

Cyrill Glasse in his The Concise Encyclopaedia of Islam states:

"Sufism is the science of the direct knowledge of God; its doctrines and methods are derived from the Koran and Islamic revelation. Like exoteric Islam, Sufism freely makes use of paradigms and concepts derived from Greek and even from Hindu sources…."

Hence Sufism is a Path with a method on the one hand and a coherent system of knowledge and metaphysics linking Creation to the Creator and our role and purpose in it on the other, which will lead towards the knowledge of God. Ismailism does satisfy the criteria; ...

The problem with your definition is that it leaves out much important detail. It is too vague, unclear, imprecise, and ambiguous. With that kind of definition anyone can be considered a Sufi and it is precisely that sort of thing that has given rise to these ‘New Age’ movements within and outside Islam i.e. Universal Sufism and the like. As a result, you have people of all persuasions i.e. agnostics, spiritualists, even Jews and Christians, etc., who think they are Sufis and can practice Sufism because of the fact that, they believe, they “satisfy its criteria.” Moreover, and I’m sure you’ll agree, that kind of definition can equally define, in broad terms, Ismailism as well. Accordingly then, these very same people can likewise be considered Ismaili since they too, now “satisfy its criteria.” But, I have no doubt you will object to that and define Ismailism much more definitely, adding important details, whether they’ll be with regards to the Imam or something else. Now you should understand that it’s the same with Tasawwuf. Sufi scholars, who are either Sunni or Shia (Twelver), do the same and on that basis don’t consider Ismailis to be Sufis, just like how, on the basis that Sufis are not connected to your present imam directly, they are not Ismailis.

[checking123]

binom, don't try to judge Others that who follow sufism and who don't and who is good and who is bad.
Let Allah decide all the matter, don't try to take the job of God in your own shoulders. You do your own, we do ours. fill your heart with LOVE, LoVE 4 all. if you see something with the eyes of Hate, all the good will fade, if you try to see the light with sun glasses, the light will seems like black.

God is Love, heart which has love, has the God, the Heart with hatred has your own ego.

We don't care, what others think of us, we simply don't care, its not our business to think what others think of us and believe me we really don't care whatever you and your fellows think of us

Good Luck Brother

Regards
"A Drop from the ocean of Love"

[naushad25]

Well said Bro checking123,<BR>have anyone seen any Ismaili o&shy;n a big platform saying this religion is bad or wrong.. or that religion is wrong. No. Never. then who are u to point o&shy;n us. I would just like to say that, after Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) many people have claimed that they are decendant from ALI (SAW) or from Mohammad (PBUH) but no o&shy;ne, not a single man or his family is in this world now who claims the same. Each and everyone said they are right imam and now they dont have any descendant for them and for their followers. Either thye say their Imam has disguised and no o&shy;ne knows about him or says thats the end of Imamat. But just our Imams family claims and they are still claiming that they are right and no o&shy;ne can say a single word o&shy;n His mouth no mater how big Ulema&nbsp;he is.&nbsp;i would say has allah stopped guiding us or has He stopped giving his blessings. Never. Has He ever stopped sending teachers for common human beings right from the start of this world then what is our fault that we dont have teacher or any o&shy;ne from allah who guides. No my brother, we have but we have to recognize him. Allah is (nauzubillah) not that cruel to His mankind that when the period of life was easy, He sent His men to guide ppl but when the period of life is o&shy;ne of the most toughest, then He has forgotten us. No. Never. He is Great and Superior Authority. We have got intellect to know what He wants from us. <BR><BR>We can also say bad words for others but if ppl dont know. i would like to remind u. if u want to confirm then ask a sincer true Ulema of urs as well. Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) said o&shy;nce that the o&shy;ne who says kalima from his mouth and accepts religion Islam and if some o&shy;ne from same religion terms Kafir o&shy;n him/her, then this act is Kufr. The words are not exact but interpretation is exact. so plz dont do Kufr.