What are your opinions on sex before marriage or living together? Recently we had an Al-Waez come to our Jamatkhana who told me that following your heart isn't wrong. I also heard that there was a time when living together was allowed (though I do not know the source of this - do enlighten me).
And even though I am more than interested in what the Qu'ran says, what do farmans say about this, if anything at all?
Sex before marriage
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Guest
yes i had also heard tht in time of hazrat mohammad (pbuh) ther was a concept of " temporary nikkah " and all sabis including hazrat ali have done this b/c as per history (especiaaly from my shia friend) since people has to go too far either for battle or dawat and to leave away from home months and years so they were permitted to have sex but o­nly after temporary nikkah but in tht case u have to give enough money to women so tht she can give birth to child and tc of child comforatbly . altough iam also not sure b/c no such thinks r reflcted in our books but main thing is tht no such problem is countered by us now a days so no question of having sex without marrige is allowed .<BR><BR>if u want farman regarding " zana " read kalam e imam e mubin lots of farman in this regards<BR>
I personally believe that sex before marriage is nothing but"LUST" and should be considered as being SINFULL.
However, sex within the context of marriag ( which should be mutually consentual ) is LOVE, as it is only after when two individuals ( man & women) commit to one another, do they indulge in an activity that involves surrending oneself to another.
However, sex within the context of marriag ( which should be mutually consentual ) is LOVE, as it is only after when two individuals ( man & women) commit to one another, do they indulge in an activity that involves surrending oneself to another.
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Guest
MOWLA ALY SAID
MOWLA ALY HAS REPORTEDLY SAID
YOU ARE NOT PUNISHED FOR YOU SINS
YOU ARE PUNISHED BY YOUR SIN
NOW WHEN IT COMES TO PREMARITAL SEX IT IS UP TO EVERYONE TO THINK FOR THEM SELVES
ARE YOU READY TO BE PUNISHED BY THIS SIN
THINK REFLECT
YOU ARE NOT PUNISHED FOR YOU SINS
YOU ARE PUNISHED BY YOUR SIN
NOW WHEN IT COMES TO PREMARITAL SEX IT IS UP TO EVERYONE TO THINK FOR THEM SELVES
ARE YOU READY TO BE PUNISHED BY THIS SIN
THINK REFLECT
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WaterFront
- Posts: 1
- Joined: Fri Jan 30, 2004 5:15 pm
Hey
Hazar Imam, as well as Imam Sultan Mohammed Shah (In his Book "Islam: The Religion of My Ancestors") have stated that in Islam, marriage is not sacred and has no religious significance.<BR><BR>This brings to light a few questions...<BR><BR>1. If marriage is not a religious thing, and people don't have to get married, does that mean they are not allowed to have sex (If Islam is against premarital sex...i am not saying it is, i don't know if it is or not)<BR><BR>2. Are you allowed to have kids if you don't get married, since being married in the eyes of God is not a religious thing<BR><BR>3. What about dating? My Sunni friends place extremely strict rules o­n dating. They have told me explicitly that there is no dating in Islam unless you are going to get engaged with the girl. Furthermore, how does it work with us (Ismailies). Are we allowed to date and get into relationships or is that against our faith.<BR><BR>And what about girls who are non-Ismaili?<BR><BR>Thanks a lot everyone!
There is no right or wrong answer for questions like these (Sex, Drinking).. I think this is more a cultural issue than a religious one.. At the end of the day, its your choice.. GOD has given you the right to choose.. Ask yourself the same question and honestly listen to the answer you get.. If you can justify yourself as to what you are doing is right. Then you dont have to care about what others think...
just a reply to lakhania's post..........why do you think hazar imam is there and then holy prophet came and all the prophets came.....and then why did he send the holy quran.....when man should make his own choice........murder is considered wrong because society says its wrong....do you think its right to murder someone if the person hurts you...(in this case you think it is right i know this is the extreme but just an example)....then in that state murdering a person is right........the western world said drinking is right we all drink like fools.......you cant change religion on your choice......other wise hazar imam would not have said that it will make me very unhappy unhappy that you smoke.......precious gems vol 1.......so if he is saying smoking is bad which is not that bad because it doenst take over your senses then how can you say drinking is okay. And smoking weed is considered better than smoking or drinking........and now canada is almost in the process of legalizing it so now thats fine too.......well think think.....just my opinion.
The temporary marriage reffered here is calld as Muta/ Seegha.. being an arabic word which means pleasure.. it eas permitted by prophet... Moula ALi.. imam jaffer... i guess it is allowed... i quote a few ayaa n hadith and info is as follows:
In mut’a a fixed period for the marriage is specified. There are no limits to period for mut’a. A validly contracted mut’a need not include sexual gratification; indeed, woman can make it a condition of the contract that no intercourse will take place.
Allah, to whom belong Might and Majesty, said: (...Except the forbidden women) the rest are lawful unto you to seek them with gifts from your property (i.e., dowry), provided that you desire protection (from sin), not fornication. So for whatever you have had of pleasure (Istamta'tum) with them by the contract, give unto them their appointed wages as a duty. And there is no sin for you in what you both agree (in extending the contract) after fulfilling the (first) duty. Lo! Allah is ever Knower, Wise. (Quran 4:24)
Ali said: The Mut'a is a mercy from Allah to his servants. If it were not for Umar forbidding it, no one would commit (the sin) of fornication except the wretched (Shaqi; an utmost wrong-doer)."
4:3 "...Marry women of your choice two or three or four; but if you fear that you shall not be able to deal justly (with them) then only one..." 4:4: "And give the women (of permanent marriage) their dower as a free gift"
"The verse of Mut'a (4:24) was revealed in Allah's Book, and there did NOT came any other verse after that to abrogate it; and the Prophet ORDERED US to do it, so we did it at the time of Allah's Apostle, and he did not forbade us from it till he died.
The Imam Ja'far (AS) considered Mut'a a divine mercy by means of which people were saved from the sin of fornication and delivered from God's retribution. Concerning the Quranic verse: "Whatsoever mercy God opens to men, none can withhold (35:2)," the Imam said: "Mut'a is part of that mercy." (Wasa'il al-Shia, v14, p439).
Muta was later forbaddin by Hazrat Usman but shia's do not follwo him... then hazrat Ali's words n imam jaffer sadiq agreed/ allowed it too.. therefore for shiites it was never prohibbited but was refered to as a mercy as Mola ali said. I have quiet a lot of info.. if anyones really interested can lemme know... coz not all that can be posted here...
In mut’a a fixed period for the marriage is specified. There are no limits to period for mut’a. A validly contracted mut’a need not include sexual gratification; indeed, woman can make it a condition of the contract that no intercourse will take place.
Allah, to whom belong Might and Majesty, said: (...Except the forbidden women) the rest are lawful unto you to seek them with gifts from your property (i.e., dowry), provided that you desire protection (from sin), not fornication. So for whatever you have had of pleasure (Istamta'tum) with them by the contract, give unto them their appointed wages as a duty. And there is no sin for you in what you both agree (in extending the contract) after fulfilling the (first) duty. Lo! Allah is ever Knower, Wise. (Quran 4:24)
Ali said: The Mut'a is a mercy from Allah to his servants. If it were not for Umar forbidding it, no one would commit (the sin) of fornication except the wretched (Shaqi; an utmost wrong-doer)."
4:3 "...Marry women of your choice two or three or four; but if you fear that you shall not be able to deal justly (with them) then only one..." 4:4: "And give the women (of permanent marriage) their dower as a free gift"
"The verse of Mut'a (4:24) was revealed in Allah's Book, and there did NOT came any other verse after that to abrogate it; and the Prophet ORDERED US to do it, so we did it at the time of Allah's Apostle, and he did not forbade us from it till he died.
The Imam Ja'far (AS) considered Mut'a a divine mercy by means of which people were saved from the sin of fornication and delivered from God's retribution. Concerning the Quranic verse: "Whatsoever mercy God opens to men, none can withhold (35:2)," the Imam said: "Mut'a is part of that mercy." (Wasa'il al-Shia, v14, p439).
Muta was later forbaddin by Hazrat Usman but shia's do not follwo him... then hazrat Ali's words n imam jaffer sadiq agreed/ allowed it too.. therefore for shiites it was never prohibbited but was refered to as a mercy as Mola ali said. I have quiet a lot of info.. if anyones really interested can lemme know... coz not all that can be posted here...
Yam
Looking top whole lot of discussion above...i have nothing much to say as we all have answers with US ONLY...if we r farmanbardar momins ( abit atleast) the we will avoid drinking and smoking as it is not permitted by our imams and...as far as premarital sex is considered it is no doubt wrong and unethical for the society in which any person lives...but ultimate decisions is taken by oneself and limits are self set....One has to think about SEX(before marraige), SMOKING and DRINKING twice ..thrice or i shud say a millions times before going for this....and if you really THINK u will say NO to all the three.
Re: Yam
Think about SEX... I am a Guy, I think about it every day, a million times!!!amynuk wrote:....One has to think about SEX(before marraige), SMOKING and DRINKING twice ..thrice or i shud say a millions times before going for this...
But with all seriousness, I think it could to taboo depending upon the society, region, culture or times that one lives in.
Drugs, sex, Alcohol,etc. Are just issues of life and nothing more. I think in the end only one thing should be considered - are we doing something that will hinder us from becoming enlightened. Even something as small as lying should carry the same weight as having premarital sex. However, people ask if it is wrong or right, or if our religion allows it so that they can engage in the activity. Just think about whatever you do in life this way: Does what I engage in have any benefit to me as a person? Will it cause any issues? And, does it help me grow spiritually? If you can answer these questions correctly I do not think you will make the wrong decision.
Question:
Someone that lives their life in Muslim country for eg. Pakistan has absolutely No chance of ever indulging into premerital sex(Im sure there is some exceptions). While a young man growing up in western world has seen the other side of the Horizon by the time he/she turns 16.
Peer pressure and young age exposure is a lot greater effect on decision making for young kids than most of us can imagine.
Now question is does God judge people according to their circumstances Or is their same rules for every one of us. What does Islam say about it.
I mean a person can try as much as he wants and dosent get even a glimpse of it in one part of the world. While on the other part you are pressured to do it just to fit in. Is graveness of the sin same or does it vary depending on the enviornment.
Someone that lives their life in Muslim country for eg. Pakistan has absolutely No chance of ever indulging into premerital sex(Im sure there is some exceptions). While a young man growing up in western world has seen the other side of the Horizon by the time he/she turns 16.
Peer pressure and young age exposure is a lot greater effect on decision making for young kids than most of us can imagine.
Now question is does God judge people according to their circumstances Or is their same rules for every one of us. What does Islam say about it.
I mean a person can try as much as he wants and dosent get even a glimpse of it in one part of the world. While on the other part you are pressured to do it just to fit in. Is graveness of the sin same or does it vary depending on the enviornment.
Azamour, how come you're asking so many hard questions brother??azamour wrote:Question:
Someone that lives their life in Muslim country for eg. Pakistan has absolutely No chance of ever indulging into premerital sex(Im sure there is some exceptions). While a young man growing up in western world has seen the other side of the Horizon by the time he/she turns 16.
Peer pressure and young age exposure is a lot greater effect on decision making for young kids than most of us can imagine.
Now question is does God judge people according to their circumstances Or is their same rules for every one of us. What does Islam say about it.
I mean a person can try as much as he wants and dosent get even a glimpse of it in one part of the world. While on the other part you are pressured to do it just to fit in. Is graveness of the sin same or does it vary depending on the enviornment.
Here is my answer: Your soul has more responsibilities in managing its pure spiritual level if your worldly surroundings does not give you enough breathing room. It is much easier for your soul in conformed surrdounings though. But remember ....... vegetative/mineral body is just a vessel for the soul to carry forward towards purification. You cannot remain aloof to your surroundings, hence Imam always emphasizes the need to keep the Islamic traditions especially if you live in the West. But that does not mean we all become mystics and exclude ourselves in the cave---nope, that goes against our traditions.I won't take any further questions on advancement and backwardness of the societies, you make your own judgement.
BTW, your "some exception in Pakistan" made me laugh out loud. You sure there are some exceptions when it comes to pre-marital sex in Pakistan??? I think there are many exceptions.
But I see your point. 
hmm
I too have wondered numerous times whether sex before marriage is right or wrong. I have questioned many and haven't had a proper answer (well an answer that makes sense to me). From what I hear, it is wrong. Actually it isn't necessarily wrong, but you should try and avoid it. Ok, say I agree. That you shouldn't have sex before marriage, then what about other sexual activities like oral sex, hugging, kissing, etc.? Is that wrong too? If someone could explain this topic in a clear, brief manner, that would be great.
Re: hmm
It depends on whose definition of S E X you are using. From what I know folks on this site love President Clintonsameer99 wrote: That you shouldn't have sex before marriage, then what about other sexual activities like oral sex, hugging, kissing, etc.? Is that wrong too? If someone could explain this topic in a clear, brief manner, that would be great.
Sorry for waking up an old threrad:
I know sex before marriage is wrong, let's say you have no sex but, you masterbate. Do you get paap (Sins) for that?
The other thing is, when you're married and you think about other women besides your own wife. Again, do you get paap? and is that considered cheating?
Pls don't take my questions as a joke. I asked because i want to know and gain knowledge.
I know sex before marriage is wrong, let's say you have no sex but, you masterbate. Do you get paap (Sins) for that?
The other thing is, when you're married and you think about other women besides your own wife. Again, do you get paap? and is that considered cheating?
Pls don't take my questions as a joke. I asked because i want to know and gain knowledge.
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From_Alamut
- Posts: 666
- Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 8:22 am
Of couse, it is Haram and wrong and forbidding in the name of Islam, when you are married and in the same time your with different women and thinking dirty... My brother, when you are married then all other women become like your sisters, so please be carefull........AsadALLAH wrote:Sorry for waking up an old threrad:
I know sex before marriage is wrong, let's say you have no sex but, you masterbate. Do you get paap (Sins) for that?
The other thing is, when you're married and you think about other women besides your own wife. Again, do you get paap? and is that considered cheating?
Pls don't take my questions as a joke. I asked because i want to know and gain knowledge.
Sorry I didn't get that, what do you mean by [[Masterbate]] ??? That word is not even in my dictionary.... But any way still if you mean "No Sex at all" you do other thing, that is too BIG SIN....... You know God created women as partner for man, so my friend, the only chance you got to get marry and become free of your(physical) ego.
In Iran, many unwed couples live together as they do not have money for dowry and because divorce is very expensive. It is called 'White marriage'. Among Middle East Sunnis, there is a trend called Travel marriage. Please read following report from Los Angeles Times dated may 29, 2015
Vas Salam
Asghar Vasanwala
'White marriage' a growing trend for young couples in Iran
Iran has a dress code for women, and rules about conduct in public are strict. Unmarried couples who date or engage in hand-holding can find themselves on the wrong side of the law.
By Ramin Mostaghim and Sarah Parvini
In Iran, many unwed couples living together wear fake wedding bands in case they are stopped by police
Young unmarried Iranian couples are living together in illegal 'white marriages'
Nina and Ahmad have lived happily together in their small one-bedroom apartment for years. They share the cost of groceries; they split the rent.
But in Iran, where Islamic teachings are woven into all aspects of life, theirs is a delicate — and illegal — arrangement: They are not married.
The pair is among a growing number of young couples in Iran who are living together without exchanging vows, a trend that the government says undermines the country's religious values.
Last year, the chief of staff to the supreme leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, called cohabitation "shameful."
"The Islamic ruler should strongly fight this kind of life," said Mohammad Mohammadi Golpayegani, and officials should "show no mercy" in cracking down on the practice.
In April, the government shut down a women's magazine for dedicating a special report to cohabitation, a practice commonly referred to as "white marriage."
There are no official estimates on the number of unmarried couples cohabiting in Iran, where those who engage in sex, dating or even hand holding out of wedlock find themselves on the wrong side of the law. But officials such as Siyavash Shahrivar, deputy governor of greater Tehran, say that "white marriages" are on the increase.
With about 60% of the population younger than 30, cohabitation is inevitable in Iran, according to Nina Ansary, an expert on women's rights in the Islamic Republic. And although the official rhetoric is hard-line, a significant portion of Iranian society is more sophisticated and less hidebound than the ruling establishment.
Iranian women, Ansary said, are "fearless."
"Everything that is forbidden, from dancing to drinking to having sex, is being practiced underground," she said. "What's remarkable about a generation born and raised in this climate is that they do not reflect the conservative laws."
"Many Iranians cohabit before marriage. It's economical. It's a way to date and live together and not be bound by the heavy weight of marriage in a country that handicaps its youth at every turn."
To mask their mores, many unmarried couples wear fake wedding bands and memorize each other's family trees, small protections to make their phony marriages seem real in case they are stopped
"It's just a way of self-preservation," Ansary said. "A way to remain under the radar of orthodoxy."
Like other unmarried couples, Nina and Ahmad declined to give their last names. She is in her second white marriage. Living together, though illegal, is "more humane" than a rushed marriage, she said.
Her family doesn't mind the living arrangement. They don't "stick their noses" into her affairs, she explained.
"When you earn your living and … are an independent woman, nobody should dare to ask you about marriage," said Nina, 28.
Government officials disagree, however, and say white marriage puts women at a disadvantage. If a boyfriend is abusive, they argue, a woman has no legal protection.
Nina scoffed at that argument.
"We can break up whenever we want," she said. "We don't know what our future will be."
For Ahmad, white marriage is also attractive for financial reasons. Traditional marriage can be too expensive for young Iranians struggling to cope in a poor economy, he said.
"Why on earth do we have to spend tens of millions of tomans to be locked into married life and potentially a very expensive divorce?" Ahmad, 30, said.
The nation's divorce rate has nearly tripled in the last 15 years and about 20% of marriages end in divorce, according to Iranian media reports.
Not only are divorces expensive in Iran, but they are also difficult for women to get. If a husband is unwilling to divorce his wife, she has to prove, legally, that he has been physically abusive, has psychological problems or has failed to fulfill his marital duties.
Jumping through such hoops once was enough for Ziba, who divorced after one year of marriage. The 32-year-old now lives with her boyfriend, Amir Ali, in an apartment near Tehran University.
"Wedding ceremonies are getting more expensive and dowries are neck-breaking," Ziba said.
Dowries in Iran, called mehrieh, are usually paid in the form of gold coins, but some women have begun waiving the cash in exchange for divorce settlements.
Traditional marriages are collapsing anyway, Amir Ali said. "If one day we can afford it, we will get married. It's not anyone's business — our parents or our government."
The couple's only legal alternative to traditional marriage is sigheh, a temporary marriage under Islamic law. The short-term contract allows relations before marriage. Sigheh can last for as little as a few hours or it can span decades, and it doesn't end in costly divorce.
Although government officials and clerics advise young men to consider temporary marriages, the practice is frowned upon by many Iranians, especially educated young women such as Ziba, who find it offensive.
As she sat in her living room filled with the books and DVDs that she and Amir Ali have collected together, Ziba wondered how long unmarried Iranian couples will have to live "a double life." She said she hopes that one day, Iran's government will be more accepting of white marriage.
"Inshallah," Ziba said. God willing.
Special correspondent Mostaghim reported from Tehran and Times staff writer Parvini from Los Angeles.
http://secure.campaigner.com/Campaigner ... u1v73&_v=2
Vas Salam
Asghar Vasanwala
'White marriage' a growing trend for young couples in Iran
Iran has a dress code for women, and rules about conduct in public are strict. Unmarried couples who date or engage in hand-holding can find themselves on the wrong side of the law.
By Ramin Mostaghim and Sarah Parvini
In Iran, many unwed couples living together wear fake wedding bands in case they are stopped by police
Young unmarried Iranian couples are living together in illegal 'white marriages'
Nina and Ahmad have lived happily together in their small one-bedroom apartment for years. They share the cost of groceries; they split the rent.
But in Iran, where Islamic teachings are woven into all aspects of life, theirs is a delicate — and illegal — arrangement: They are not married.
The pair is among a growing number of young couples in Iran who are living together without exchanging vows, a trend that the government says undermines the country's religious values.
Last year, the chief of staff to the supreme leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, called cohabitation "shameful."
"The Islamic ruler should strongly fight this kind of life," said Mohammad Mohammadi Golpayegani, and officials should "show no mercy" in cracking down on the practice.
In April, the government shut down a women's magazine for dedicating a special report to cohabitation, a practice commonly referred to as "white marriage."
There are no official estimates on the number of unmarried couples cohabiting in Iran, where those who engage in sex, dating or even hand holding out of wedlock find themselves on the wrong side of the law. But officials such as Siyavash Shahrivar, deputy governor of greater Tehran, say that "white marriages" are on the increase.
With about 60% of the population younger than 30, cohabitation is inevitable in Iran, according to Nina Ansary, an expert on women's rights in the Islamic Republic. And although the official rhetoric is hard-line, a significant portion of Iranian society is more sophisticated and less hidebound than the ruling establishment.
Iranian women, Ansary said, are "fearless."
"Everything that is forbidden, from dancing to drinking to having sex, is being practiced underground," she said. "What's remarkable about a generation born and raised in this climate is that they do not reflect the conservative laws."
"Many Iranians cohabit before marriage. It's economical. It's a way to date and live together and not be bound by the heavy weight of marriage in a country that handicaps its youth at every turn."
To mask their mores, many unmarried couples wear fake wedding bands and memorize each other's family trees, small protections to make their phony marriages seem real in case they are stopped
"It's just a way of self-preservation," Ansary said. "A way to remain under the radar of orthodoxy."
Like other unmarried couples, Nina and Ahmad declined to give their last names. She is in her second white marriage. Living together, though illegal, is "more humane" than a rushed marriage, she said.
Her family doesn't mind the living arrangement. They don't "stick their noses" into her affairs, she explained.
"When you earn your living and … are an independent woman, nobody should dare to ask you about marriage," said Nina, 28.
Government officials disagree, however, and say white marriage puts women at a disadvantage. If a boyfriend is abusive, they argue, a woman has no legal protection.
Nina scoffed at that argument.
"We can break up whenever we want," she said. "We don't know what our future will be."
For Ahmad, white marriage is also attractive for financial reasons. Traditional marriage can be too expensive for young Iranians struggling to cope in a poor economy, he said.
"Why on earth do we have to spend tens of millions of tomans to be locked into married life and potentially a very expensive divorce?" Ahmad, 30, said.
The nation's divorce rate has nearly tripled in the last 15 years and about 20% of marriages end in divorce, according to Iranian media reports.
Not only are divorces expensive in Iran, but they are also difficult for women to get. If a husband is unwilling to divorce his wife, she has to prove, legally, that he has been physically abusive, has psychological problems or has failed to fulfill his marital duties.
Jumping through such hoops once was enough for Ziba, who divorced after one year of marriage. The 32-year-old now lives with her boyfriend, Amir Ali, in an apartment near Tehran University.
"Wedding ceremonies are getting more expensive and dowries are neck-breaking," Ziba said.
Dowries in Iran, called mehrieh, are usually paid in the form of gold coins, but some women have begun waiving the cash in exchange for divorce settlements.
Traditional marriages are collapsing anyway, Amir Ali said. "If one day we can afford it, we will get married. It's not anyone's business — our parents or our government."
The couple's only legal alternative to traditional marriage is sigheh, a temporary marriage under Islamic law. The short-term contract allows relations before marriage. Sigheh can last for as little as a few hours or it can span decades, and it doesn't end in costly divorce.
Although government officials and clerics advise young men to consider temporary marriages, the practice is frowned upon by many Iranians, especially educated young women such as Ziba, who find it offensive.
As she sat in her living room filled with the books and DVDs that she and Amir Ali have collected together, Ziba wondered how long unmarried Iranian couples will have to live "a double life." She said she hopes that one day, Iran's government will be more accepting of white marriage.
"Inshallah," Ziba said. God willing.
Special correspondent Mostaghim reported from Tehran and Times staff writer Parvini from Los Angeles.
http://secure.campaigner.com/Campaigner ... u1v73&_v=2