mowla in dreams

imranramji2011 · Post by **imranramji2011** » Sun Mar 27, 2011 10:01 pm

so for the last few days i have been having dreams of mowla. In these dreams i bump or should i say meet mowla in the most unimaginable places like a grocery store a gas station or the park. is mowla trying to tell me somthing or what

agakhani · Post by **agakhani** » Mon Mar 28, 2011 8:44 am

You should not tell anyone if Mowla comes in your dream, by the way since you already disclose about your dream then let me give you congratulations brother you are one of those lucky persons who dreams mowla many times.

The interpretation of any dream is tough subject and for this thousands and thousands books have been written so far, it is possible that mowla wants to give some kind particular messages to you to find out this message, you need to ask your self this question and I am pretty sure that you will definitely receive answer from your soul.

From_Alamut · Post by **From_Alamut** » Sun Apr 03, 2011 10:52 pm

imranramji2011 wrote:so for the last few days i have been having dreams of mowla. In these dreams i bump or should i say meet mowla in the most unimaginable places like a grocery store a gas station or the park. is mowla trying to tell me somthing or what

Ah, how lucky you brother, I wish to dream about the Beloved every night.

Bloglaw · Post by **Bloglaw** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:41 am

imranramji2011 wrote:so for the last few days i have been having dreams of mowla. In these dreams i bump or should i say meet mowla in the most unimaginable places like a grocery store a gas station or the park. is mowla trying to tell me somthing or what

Congratulations. This has much significance and interconnected to your personal life. I suggest you discuss this with a senior Al Waezeen, whose contact details can be provided by your Mukhi or ITREB. It is a my/Scholar. It is a myth not to share or talk about it or there is some spiritual benefit for keeping it to yourself.

Bloglaw · Post by **Bloglaw** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:02 am

agakhani wrote:You should not tell anyone if Mowla comes in your dream, by the way since you already disclose about your dream then let me give you congratulations brother you are one of those lucky persons who dreams mowla many times.

The interpretation of any dream is tough subject and for this thousands and thousands books have been written so far, it is possible that mowla wants to give some kind particular messages to you to find out this message, you need to ask your self this question and I am pretty sure that you will definitely receive answer from your soul.

It is not correct that you should not disclose and keep this worderful experience to yourself. How else will he learn and understand. Can you let us have the names of 2 or 3 books on dreams from our perspective and in Islam. Thank you.

Whilst many of us find answers ourselves from within us, many of us need some assistence and guidance to do so. I am happy that you are able to find answers from within you.

agakhani · Post by **agakhani** » Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:00 pm

Can you let us have the names of 2 or 3 books on dreams from our perspective and in Islam. Thank you.

Below are few dream books written on Islamic perspective:-

1, LAL KITAB ( FOR ALL MUSLIMS) English and Persian translation
also available (on dreams, faal,( almanac) astrology e.t.c.)
2, Ibn Seerin's Dictionary of Dreams:( BEST BOOKS FOR ALL MUSLIMS)
3, The Early Muslim Tradition of Dream Interpretation (ON SUNNY
PERSPECTIVE)

I do not think any drem book has written on Ismaili perspective yet, I am not pretty sure but if any one know about this please let me know.

Why you should not tell your dream?

Well, there is no scientific reason as far as I know, but there is a religious reason, I heard from my parents, from many
Ismailis and from one waezin that you should not tell your dream if mowla comes in your dream, according them if you do this
then Mowla does not come in your dream very often after that, this way you loose the didar in dream of mowla, believe me I had this experience in past.

atharvedi · Post by **atharvedi** » Mon May 09, 2011 8:19 am

Farman on 'Mowla comes in dream' KIM Farman #77

Kalame Imame Mubin, Farman no. 77, Jamnagar 12th Nov 1903

"Agar koi kahe ke, Saaheb khwaabmaa(n) aave chhe to te badhu(n) jutthu(n) chhe. Ame koinaa khwaabmaa(n) aavataa nathi. Te badhaa ddho(n)g chhe; agar koinaa khwaabmaa(n) aave to pann te mannas bolto nathi. Koine amaaro lebaas, paheraavi kahevu(n) ke 'Saaheb aavyaa' te badhaa ddho(n)g chhe. Ame aavataa nathi. Evu(n) jutthu(n) bolavu(n) nahi joi-e."

*Ddho(n)g - hypocrisy, act, affectation, colour, make-believe, pretence, pretense, craft, PRETENDS
http://shabdkosh.raftaar.in/Hindi-Dicti ... ning/dhong

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Mon May 09, 2011 11:24 am

Kalame Imame Mubin, Farman no. 77, Jamnagar 12th Nov 1903

"Agar koi kahe ke, Saaheb khwaabmaa(n) aave chhe to te badhu(n) jutthu(n) chhe. Ame koinaa khwaabmaa(n) aavataa nathi. Te badhaa ddho(n)g chhe; agar koinaa khwaabmaa(n) aave to pann te mannas bolto nathi. Koine amaaro lebaas, paheraavi kahevu(n) ke 'Saaheb aavyaa' te badhaa ddho(n)g chhe. Ame aavataa nathi. Evu(n) jutthu(n) bolavu(n) nahi joi-e."

These are pretty tough words atharvedi bhai !!.....So if the person who actually had a dream and in that dream he saw the imam .....thats not actually the imam ??

so if imam is saying he doesnt come in anybodies dream then i think that goes against the ginans !!! ...Is it not ??

kmaherali · Post by **kmaherali** » Mon May 09, 2011 2:32 pm

shiraz.virani wrote: so if imam is saying he doesnt come in anybodies dream then i think that goes against the ginans !!! ...Is it not ??

Which Ginan states that the Imam appears in dreams?

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Mon May 09, 2011 3:40 pm

I was talking about the dream that king harishchandra informs his wife about ....But i think the dream was just the story or he was just trying to test his wife .....further assistance would be appreciated !!!

Anyways maherali bhai whats your take on the above firman ?? If imam says that he doesnt come in anybodies dreams then what the use of BOL ??

And does this mean that we shouldnt focus or think of imam while reciting tasbih/zikr ??

kmaherali · Post by **kmaherali** » Mon May 09, 2011 4:17 pm

shiraz.virani wrote:I was talking about the dream that king harishchandra informs his wife about ....But i think the dream was just the story or he was just trying to test his wife .....further assistance would be appreciated !!!

I think Raja Harischandra actually followed Tararani to find out what she was up to but of course he could not tell her that, so he made up a story about a dream....

shiraz.virani wrote: Anyways maherali bhai whats your take on the above firman ?? If imam says that he doesnt come in anybodies dreams then what the use of BOL ??

And does this mean that we shouldnt focus or think of imam while reciting tasbih/zikr ??

My take on the Farman is that whether he appears or not is a personal matter to the individual and it should never be mentioned to anyone else.

I do not see any connection with the BOL. The BOL does not have any bearing on his physical aspect.

When performing zikr, we are not thinking of his physical form but upon the meaning of zikr. The focus is upon the Noor which is non-physical. The ultimate experience is something that cannot be described, so how can it have any relation to the physical aspect of the Imam?

In the Ginan Sakhi Mahapad, Pir Sadardeen says:

sakhee kahevaa sareekho nathee ke maaro saamee jee re
eto jovaa sareekho chhe alakh anaamee re.........................12

O beloved ones, my Lord (attained through this experience) does
not bear any telling (as He is undescribable) and He is nameless.
He can only be seen (by inner eyes) or experienced.

shiraz.virani · Post by **shiraz.virani** » Mon May 09, 2011 6:20 pm

so how can it have any relation to the physical aspect of the Imam?

Well most of the times maherali bhai....say for example bandagi....most ismailis have an image in their head when they pray....and that image is that of imam...so are you saying that the murids should not have any kind of image while performing bandagi ??

kmaherali · Post by **kmaherali** » Mon May 09, 2011 7:05 pm

shiraz.virani wrote:
so how can it have any relation to the physical aspect of the Imam?
Well most of the times maherali bhai....say for example bandagi....most ismailis have an image in their head when they pray....and that image is that of imam...so are you saying that the murids should not have any kind of image while performing bandagi ??

Yes, the only focus should be on the meaning of the BOL or any zikr one may choose (if one does not have BOL). The purpose of bandagi is to attain a deeper meaning and understanding of life and 'he who is above all else'. It is not about attaining physical closeness with the Imam.

There should be no worldly images and thoughts about worldly matters when performing bandagi.

atharvedi · Post by **atharvedi** » Tue May 10, 2011 9:12 am

shiraz.virani wrote:
Kalame Imame Mubin, Farman no. 77, Jamnagar 12th Nov 1903

"Agar koi kahe ke, Saaheb khwaabmaa(n) aave chhe to te badhu(n) jutthu(n) chhe. Ame koinaa khwaabmaa(n) aavataa nathi. Te badhaa ddho(n)g chhe; agar koinaa khwaabmaa(n) aave to pann te mannas bolto nathi. Koine amaaro lebaas, paheraavi kahevu(n) ke 'Saaheb aavyaa' te badhaa ddho(n)g chhe. Ame aavataa nathi. Evu(n) jutthu(n) bolavu(n) nahi joi-e."
These are pretty tough words atharvedi bhai !!.....So if the person who actually had a dream and in that dream he saw the imam .....thats not actually the imam ??

so if imam is saying he doesnt come in anybodies dream then i think that goes against the ginans !!! ...Is it not ??

Ya Ali Madad Shiraz,

I am not comfortable to discuss on the above topic, as per the farman we should not talk about it. It is personal and individual experience and never discuss with anyone. Karimbai has already explained and I don't see it requires any further clarification.

I think this topic should be deleted or at least disable any replies. The whole point of the above farman was to discontinue the discussion. This is what I was hoping at least after reading the farman the discussion will stop and there will be no such topic raised or discuss in future.

Hope you understand my point of view, by stopping the discussion we will at least follow the above farman faithfully.
No offence to anyone.

azizhussain · Post by **azizhussain** » Tue May 10, 2011 11:12 am

atharvedi wrote:Farman on 'Mowla comes in dream' KIM Farman #77

Kalame Imame Mubin, Farman no. 77, Jamnagar 12th Nov 1903

"Agar koi kahe ke, Saaheb khwaabmaa(n) aave chhe to te badhu(n) jutthu(n) chhe. Ame koinaa khwaabmaa(n) aavataa nathi. Te badhaa ddho(n)g chhe; agar koinaa khwaabmaa(n) aave to pann te mannas bolto nathi. Koine amaaro lebaas, paheraavi kahevu(n) ke 'Saaheb aavyaa' te badhaa ddho(n)g chhe. Ame aavataa nathi. Evu(n) jutthu(n) bolavu(n) nahi joi-e."

*Ddho(n)g - hypocrisy, act, affectation, colour, make-believe, pretence, pretense, craft, PRETENDS
http://shabdkosh.raftaar.in/Hindi-Dicti ... ning/dhong

I dont speak gujrati. Can someone please translate the above farman.

thanks

agakhani · Post by **agakhani** » Tue May 10, 2011 11:57 am

Here is the translation of above farman in simple English

"Agar koi kahe ke, Saaheb khwaabmaa(n) aave chhe to te badhu(n) jutthu(n) chhe

If anyone says that Saaheb (MHI) comes in my dream then it is all wrong.

Ame koinaa khwaabmaa(n) aavataa nathi. Te badhaa ddho(n)g chhe; agar koinaa khwaabmaa(n) aave to pann te mannas bolto nathi.

We (imams) are not comes in anybodies dream, it is all hypocrisy (if he say that MHI comes in my dream), if (Imam) comes to anyone's dream then he wouldn't tell nobody.

Koine amaaro lebaas, paheraavi kahevu(n) ke 'Saaheb aavyaa' te badhaa ddho(n)g chhe

To see someone else in dream and tell that Imam comes in my dream, is not right, it is hypocrisy.

Ame aavataa nathi. Evu(n) jutthu(n) bolavu(n) nahi joi-e."

We are not coming in dream and therefore nobody should lie about this.

agakhani · Post by **agakhani** » Tue May 10, 2011 12:54 pm

Code: Select all

"Agar koi kahe ke, Saaheb khwaabmaa&#40;n&#41; aave chhe to te badhu&#40;n&#41; jutthu&#40;n&#41; chhe. Ame koinaa khwaabmaa&#40;n&#41; aavataa nathi. Te badhaa ddho&#40;n&#41;g chhe; agar koinaa khwaabmaa&#40;n&#41; aave to pann te mannas bolto nathi. Koine amaaro lebaas, paheraavi kahevu&#40;n&#41; ke 'Saaheb aavyaa' te badhaa ddho&#40;n&#41;g chhe. Ame aavataa nathi. Evu&#40;n&#41; jutthu&#40;n&#41; bolavu&#40;n&#41; nahi joi-e."

ASTAGAFIRULLAH, NEITHER I THINK THAT MSM QUOTED WRONG FARMAN, NOR I HAVE ANY INTENTION TO PROVE THIS FARMAN IS WRONG but..... one question arising in my mind:-
Is not this controversial farman of MSM? he say in one line that we don't come in dream to anyone and next sentence he says that if we come in dream of anyone then he/she wouldn't tell to anybody else. that means Mowla comes in dream in dream of some lucky dudes.
It is 100% possible that I misunderstood above farman wrong also it might possible that I interpreted it wrong but any clarification on above farman will be highly appreciated.

It is against the rule of Ismaili.net to print any farman of MHI, so I agree with Mr. Atharvedi's comments on this farman and his opinion on dream which I quote here again "It is personal and individual experience and never discuss with anyone" so if Admin disable this topic then it will be fine with me but here is my own opinions on dream that nobody should discuss or tell anybody, if mowla comes in your dream.

star_munir · Post by **star_munir** » Mon Sep 05, 2011 9:36 pm

There can be different reasons for Imam for saying this. I think, this way He prevented us from falling in trap of rumor. Many people spread false stories about Imam or spread false sayings attributing it to Imam. There may be likelihood that some people tell others that Imam has come in our dream and instructed you, or every one to do this or do that and thats why all should do this.
Imam has clarified about the issue of dreams in Farman.

agakhani · Post by **agakhani** » Tue Sep 06, 2011 8:06 am

I think, this way He prevented us from falling in trap of rumor. Many people spread false stories about Imam or spread false sayings attributing it to Imam.

Your above reason seems decent reason, it might be right reason for Mowla's denial that Imam never comes in anybody's dream, but what do you think about tMowla's dreams, should we tell everyone or not?

star_munir · Post by **star_munir** » Tue Sep 06, 2011 9:38 pm

Dreams are imaginary thought of a person and some times quite absurd. Some times people dream what they desire the most. According to Carl Jung, dreams are related to the wishes of a person which he/she unconsciously desires. Its not necessary that what a person is dreaming is showing a reality. For instance there have been cases when people did evil work and said that they had got command from the Prophet in dream. Prophet could certainly not come in their dream to direct them for that.

I am not saying every thing is fake, incorrect. But I think, if some one get any spiritual experience, then he/she shall not speak about it with others.
I may be incorrect. But you can read, whats there in Farman abt that.
Also if you have Noorum Mubin, there is one anecdote about the dream of Khwaja Kamaluddin's dream. It is mentioned in the secion of history of Imam Sultan Mohamed Shah. Khwaja Kamaluddin while narrating the dream could not directly wrote the name of Imam.

agakhani · Post by **agakhani** » Wed Sep 07, 2011 10:11 am

Also if you have Noorum Mubin, there is one anecdote about the dream of Khwaja Kamaluddin's dream. It is mentioned in the secion of history of Imam Sultan Mohamed Shah

Yes, I do have Nooran Mubibn and I will sure read dream of Khwaja Kamaluddin.

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mowla in dreams

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Farman on 'Mowla comes in dream' KIM Farman #77

Re: Farman on 'Mowla comes in dream' KIM Farman #77