Pundit Vedprakash Upadhyay has been wrote a book name "Kalki Avatar" in India this books has been big topic of discussion and gossip all over the world even in USA (IL & Texas) This book has been written after years of research of VEDAS, PURAN AND UPNISHADS and eight pundits have endorsed and certified his points of arguments as authentic that Hindus should not wait any longer for the arrival of Tenth Kalki Avatar because Kalki Avatar Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) has already arrived and departed from this world fourteen centuries ago. The author claim this after research of Vedas and other holy books of Hindu religion.
My question is as per our Pirs Holy Ginans the Tenth Nakalnki Avatar is Hazart Murtaza Ali (SAS) our 1st Imam!
Any coments in this topic from our Ismailies Scholars from Ismaili. Net?
"Kalki Avatar" by Pundit Vedprakash
1. Veda mentions that 'kalki autar' will be the last Messenger / Prophet of Bhagwan (Allah) to guide the whole world. Afer quoting this reference the Pundit Parkash says that this comes true only in the case of Muhammed (saw).
2. According to a prophecy of Hinduism, 'kalki autar' will be born in an island and that is the Arab territory which is known as 'jazeeratul Arab'.
3. In the 'sacred' book of Hindus the father's name of 'kalki autar' is mentioned as 'Vishnu Bhagat' and his mother's name as 'somanib'. In sanskrit, 'vishnu' stands for Allah (swt) and the literal meaning of 'bhagat' is slave. 'Vishnu Bhagat' therefore, in the Arabic language will mean Allah's slave (Abdullah). 'Somanib' in Sanskrit means peace and tranquilty which in arabic is denoted by the word 'Amina'. Whereas the last Messenger Muhammed's (saw) father and mother's names were Abdullah and Amina respectively.
4. In the big books of Hindus, it is mentioned that 'kalki autar' will live on olive and dates and he will be true to his words and honest. In this regard Pundit Parkash writes, "This is true and established only in the case of Muhammed (saw)".
5. Veda mentions that 'kalki autar' will be born in the respected and noble dynasty of his land. And this is also true as regards Muhammed (saw) as he was born in the respected tribe of Quraish who enjoyed great respect and high place in Makkah.
6. 'Kalki Autar' will be taught in the cave by Bhagwan through his own messenger. And it is very true in this matter. Muhammed (saw) was the only one person in Makkah who has taught by Allah's Messenger Gabriel in the cave of Hira.
7. It is written in the books which Hindus believe that Bhagwan will provide 'Kalki autar' with the fastest of a horse and with the help of which he will ride around the world and the seven skies/heavens. The riding on 'Buraq' and 'Meraj' by the Prophet Muhammed (saw) proves what?
8. It is also written in the Hindus' books that 'kalki autar' will be strengthened and heavily helped by Bhagwan. And we know this fact that Muhammed (saw) was aided and reinforced by Allah (swt) through His angels in the battle of Badr.
9. Hindus' books also mention that 'kalki autar' will be an expert in horse riding, arrow shooting, and swordsmanship. What Pundit Vaid Parkash comments in this regard is very important and worth attention and consideration. He writes that the age of horses, swords, and spears is long ago gone and now is the age of modern weapons like tanks, missiles, and guns, and therefore it will be unwise to wait for 'kalki autar' bearing sword and arrows or spears. In reality, the mention in our books of 'kalki autar' is clearly indicative of Muhammed (saw) who was given the heavenly book known as Al-Qur'an.
Copyright © 1997 The Message, an ICNA Publication
2. According to a prophecy of Hinduism, 'kalki autar' will be born in an island and that is the Arab territory which is known as 'jazeeratul Arab'.
3. In the 'sacred' book of Hindus the father's name of 'kalki autar' is mentioned as 'Vishnu Bhagat' and his mother's name as 'somanib'. In sanskrit, 'vishnu' stands for Allah (swt) and the literal meaning of 'bhagat' is slave. 'Vishnu Bhagat' therefore, in the Arabic language will mean Allah's slave (Abdullah). 'Somanib' in Sanskrit means peace and tranquilty which in arabic is denoted by the word 'Amina'. Whereas the last Messenger Muhammed's (saw) father and mother's names were Abdullah and Amina respectively.
4. In the big books of Hindus, it is mentioned that 'kalki autar' will live on olive and dates and he will be true to his words and honest. In this regard Pundit Parkash writes, "This is true and established only in the case of Muhammed (saw)".
5. Veda mentions that 'kalki autar' will be born in the respected and noble dynasty of his land. And this is also true as regards Muhammed (saw) as he was born in the respected tribe of Quraish who enjoyed great respect and high place in Makkah.
6. 'Kalki Autar' will be taught in the cave by Bhagwan through his own messenger. And it is very true in this matter. Muhammed (saw) was the only one person in Makkah who has taught by Allah's Messenger Gabriel in the cave of Hira.
7. It is written in the books which Hindus believe that Bhagwan will provide 'Kalki autar' with the fastest of a horse and with the help of which he will ride around the world and the seven skies/heavens. The riding on 'Buraq' and 'Meraj' by the Prophet Muhammed (saw) proves what?
8. It is also written in the Hindus' books that 'kalki autar' will be strengthened and heavily helped by Bhagwan. And we know this fact that Muhammed (saw) was aided and reinforced by Allah (swt) through His angels in the battle of Badr.
9. Hindus' books also mention that 'kalki autar' will be an expert in horse riding, arrow shooting, and swordsmanship. What Pundit Vaid Parkash comments in this regard is very important and worth attention and consideration. He writes that the age of horses, swords, and spears is long ago gone and now is the age of modern weapons like tanks, missiles, and guns, and therefore it will be unwise to wait for 'kalki autar' bearing sword and arrows or spears. In reality, the mention in our books of 'kalki autar' is clearly indicative of Muhammed (saw) who was given the heavenly book known as Al-Qur'an.
Copyright © 1997 The Message, an ICNA Publication
"Kalki Avatar" by Pundit Vedprakash
Sadrudin,
Thanks for the intersting infomation you just posted, but I asked every reader for theier comments regarding this book, will you please give your ideas that what you think? who is Kalki Avatar? Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) or as per our Holy ginans and our belives first Imam Mowla Ali ( SAS)?
Thanks for the intersting infomation you just posted, but I asked every reader for theier comments regarding this book, will you please give your ideas that what you think? who is Kalki Avatar? Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) or as per our Holy ginans and our belives first Imam Mowla Ali ( SAS)?
Re: "Kalki Avatar" by Pundit Vedprakash
Perhaps outwardly one can say that Muhammad was the Kalki Avatar because he had the greatest impact in history just as the advent of the past Avatars. However in our tradition Aly is the Kalki Avatar bcause he was the first Imam of the new cycle and all the Imams after him are also called Naklanki Avatar. Avatars represent a phase in our history and are not confined to one person.agakhani wrote: who is Kalki Avatar? Prophet Mohammad (PBUH) or as per our Holy ginans and our belives first Imam Mowla Ali ( SAS)?
Ya ali madad,
http://www.ismaili.net/granths/dasavat.html
A SINDHI VERSION OF PIR SHAMS' DAS AVATAAR
An unpublished Ginan
DR. Gulshan Khaki
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This paper is partly based on one of my previously published paper [1] and draws freely from it.
The concept of Das Avataar has been mentioned in numerous Ginans. In the Ginanic literature there are three works which are specifically identified by the name Das Avtaar. The smallest of these three is attributed to Pir Shams and has been published in his Ginan Collection [2]. This version, which is sometimes called "Pir Shams jo Das Avataar" and consists of twenty eight lines divided into ten verses of varying length. The second version was composed by Pir Sadardin and is counted as one of his major works or Granths. This Granth is generally known as "Nano Das Avataar" and consists of about ten pages of text, divided into ten sections of varying length. The third and the largest version was composed by Sayyed Imam Shah and is known as "Moto Das Avataar". This monumental work consists of a short prologue followed by ten sections of varying length, totalling sixteen hundred verses.
While examining several manuscripts of Das Avataar, I came across in one of the manuscripts (Kx Ms. - described in another paper in this proceedings), a hereto unknown version of Das Avataar. This version is in very archaic sounding Sindhi and is attributed to Pir Shams. It seems that there is no difference in the theme or main contents between this and the other version of Pir Shams Das Avataar. However, it is the linguistic value of this newly discovered version that is of interest to us here. As far as I know, there is only one copy of it in the manuscript now in possession of Ismaili Tariqa Board of Pakistan (Karachi).
Linguistically it is interesting, because it is composed entirely in archaic sounding Sindhi. (I have appended a text of it to this paper.) In the opinion of Prof. A. Schimmel, based on the fact that the earliest Sindhi uses the littlest possible Arabic and no Persian vocabulary at all, the Sindhi Das Avataar of Pir Shams must have been composed prior to the seventeenth century A.D. In this respect it can hold comparison with the works of Shah Lutf Allah Qadiri who died in the seventeenth century A.D. In our text the following Arabic or Persian words are to be found: Shah (nine times), Ali (once), Pir Shams (once), Alamut (once), `ilm (once), Bhajara (bazar ? once), ala ( ? once), bhecara (once). At the beginning of the Ginan the instruction is given that it should be sung in the raga Kedara, which interestingly is the raga Shah Abd al-Latif of Bhit (d. 1752) uses for his poetry concerning Muharram happenings.
Since this is the only copy known at this point in time, it makes it very difficult to decipher some of the illegible and /or in-comprehensible words. Should more copies of it be found it may be possible to prepare a standard version of this Ginan. Not only would it comprise an interesting specimen of Pir Shams work in Sindhi, but it would also be a rare example of a Ginan composed in different languages for geographically diverse converts.
REFERENCES
1 Khaki G., "The Dasa Avatara of Pir Shams as linguistic and literary evidence of the early development of Ismailism in Sind"; SIND THROUGH THE CENTURIES, pp 143-155.
2 Shams Pir, Collection of Ginans; pp 35-37. Ismailia Association for India, 1952.
http://www.ismaili.net/granths/dasavat.html
A SINDHI VERSION OF PIR SHAMS' DAS AVATAAR
An unpublished Ginan
DR. Gulshan Khaki
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This paper is partly based on one of my previously published paper [1] and draws freely from it.
The concept of Das Avataar has been mentioned in numerous Ginans. In the Ginanic literature there are three works which are specifically identified by the name Das Avtaar. The smallest of these three is attributed to Pir Shams and has been published in his Ginan Collection [2]. This version, which is sometimes called "Pir Shams jo Das Avataar" and consists of twenty eight lines divided into ten verses of varying length. The second version was composed by Pir Sadardin and is counted as one of his major works or Granths. This Granth is generally known as "Nano Das Avataar" and consists of about ten pages of text, divided into ten sections of varying length. The third and the largest version was composed by Sayyed Imam Shah and is known as "Moto Das Avataar". This monumental work consists of a short prologue followed by ten sections of varying length, totalling sixteen hundred verses.
While examining several manuscripts of Das Avataar, I came across in one of the manuscripts (Kx Ms. - described in another paper in this proceedings), a hereto unknown version of Das Avataar. This version is in very archaic sounding Sindhi and is attributed to Pir Shams. It seems that there is no difference in the theme or main contents between this and the other version of Pir Shams Das Avataar. However, it is the linguistic value of this newly discovered version that is of interest to us here. As far as I know, there is only one copy of it in the manuscript now in possession of Ismaili Tariqa Board of Pakistan (Karachi).
Linguistically it is interesting, because it is composed entirely in archaic sounding Sindhi. (I have appended a text of it to this paper.) In the opinion of Prof. A. Schimmel, based on the fact that the earliest Sindhi uses the littlest possible Arabic and no Persian vocabulary at all, the Sindhi Das Avataar of Pir Shams must have been composed prior to the seventeenth century A.D. In this respect it can hold comparison with the works of Shah Lutf Allah Qadiri who died in the seventeenth century A.D. In our text the following Arabic or Persian words are to be found: Shah (nine times), Ali (once), Pir Shams (once), Alamut (once), `ilm (once), Bhajara (bazar ? once), ala ( ? once), bhecara (once). At the beginning of the Ginan the instruction is given that it should be sung in the raga Kedara, which interestingly is the raga Shah Abd al-Latif of Bhit (d. 1752) uses for his poetry concerning Muharram happenings.
Since this is the only copy known at this point in time, it makes it very difficult to decipher some of the illegible and /or in-comprehensible words. Should more copies of it be found it may be possible to prepare a standard version of this Ginan. Not only would it comprise an interesting specimen of Pir Shams work in Sindhi, but it would also be a rare example of a Ginan composed in different languages for geographically diverse converts.
REFERENCES
1 Khaki G., "The Dasa Avatara of Pir Shams as linguistic and literary evidence of the early development of Ismailism in Sind"; SIND THROUGH THE CENTURIES, pp 143-155.
2 Shams Pir, Collection of Ginans; pp 35-37. Ismailia Association for India, 1952.
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star_munir
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Kalki avtar is Hazrat Ali. The article is distorting the facts mentioned in vedas and puranas to some extent and is therefore do not seems to be reliable and authentic. Many hindu scholars have challenged this book and had given examples of several verses to show that Prophet Muhammad was not Kalki avtaar.
Some thing which I observed from this article was it mentions "'Kalki Autar' will be taught in the cave by Bhagwan through his own messenger. And it is very true in this matter. Muhammed (saw) was the only one person in Makkah who has taught by Allah's Messenger Gabriel in the cave of Hira. "
This is the point that is mentioned no where in any Hindu scripture. If you disagree with me, then give me complete reference. An avtar doesn't need angel to guide him or to tell him divine message.
The seventh point which states "It is written in the books which Hindus believe that Bhagwan will provide 'Kalki autar' with the fastest of a horse and with the help of which he will ride around the world and the seven skies/heavens "....make me think that horse mentioned here might be duldul horse of Ali. It is in Farman whoever used to call Ali, he used to come there immediately for help. Coming of Ali in duldul horse is mentioned in several ginans as well.
However I do believe there are many verses in praise of Prophet Muhammad and Ali in hindu scriptures and according to hadiths also Nabi Muhammad and Ali are from same divine light.
Some thing which I observed from this article was it mentions "'Kalki Autar' will be taught in the cave by Bhagwan through his own messenger. And it is very true in this matter. Muhammed (saw) was the only one person in Makkah who has taught by Allah's Messenger Gabriel in the cave of Hira. "
This is the point that is mentioned no where in any Hindu scripture. If you disagree with me, then give me complete reference. An avtar doesn't need angel to guide him or to tell him divine message.
The seventh point which states "It is written in the books which Hindus believe that Bhagwan will provide 'Kalki autar' with the fastest of a horse and with the help of which he will ride around the world and the seven skies/heavens "....make me think that horse mentioned here might be duldul horse of Ali. It is in Farman whoever used to call Ali, he used to come there immediately for help. Coming of Ali in duldul horse is mentioned in several ginans as well.
However I do believe there are many verses in praise of Prophet Muhammad and Ali in hindu scriptures and according to hadiths also Nabi Muhammad and Ali are from same divine light.
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star_munir
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There is very interesting waez in which it is explained about mention of Ali and Muhammad in scriptures of different religions like Hinduism, Buddhism and Sikhism. If you know the Gujarati langauge, you may listen the waez on new heritage website. The title is "mowla no rojo" and it is by Alwaez Bahadur Ali.
Mowla-No-rozo
Yes I know gujarati very well will you please give me some detail how to download and burn in cd Mowla-no-rozo Waez of Mr. Rajna?I am not computer expert so you have to tell me step by step please.
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star_munir
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Go to following link
http://ismaili.net/heritage/audio-waez- ... r2[0]=1738
you will see the list of waez in Gujarati. See waez entitled "Mowla no rojo" click on download the file. Click on save. Thats it.
http://ismaili.net/heritage/audio-waez- ... r2[0]=1738
you will see the list of waez in Gujarati. See waez entitled "Mowla no rojo" click on download the file. Click on save. Thats it.
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star_munir
- Posts: 1670
- Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2003 12:55 am
- Contact:
The Vishnu Purana (4.24) says:sadrudin wrote:1. Veda mentions that 'kalki autar' will be the last Messenger / Prophet of Bhagwan (Allah) to guide the whole world. Afer quoting this reference the Pundit Parkash says that this comes true only in the case of Muhammed (saw).
2. According to a prophecy of Hinduism, 'kalki autar' will be born in an island and that is the Arab territory which is known as 'jazeeratul Arab'.
3. In the 'sacred' book of Hindus the father's name of 'kalki autar' is mentioned as 'Vishnu Bhagat' and his mother's name as 'somanib'. In sanskrit, 'vishnu' stands for Allah (swt) and the literal meaning of 'bhagat' is slave. 'Vishnu Bhagat' therefore, in the Arabic language will mean Allah's slave (Abdullah). 'Somanib' in Sanskrit means peace and tranquilty which in arabic is denoted by the word 'Amina'. Whereas the last Messenger Muhammed's (saw) father and mother's names were Abdullah and Amina respectively.
4. In the big books of Hindus, it is mentioned that 'kalki autar' will live on olive and dates and he will be true to his words and honest. In this regard Pundit Parkash writes, "This is true and established only in the case of Muhammed (saw)".
5. Veda mentions that 'kalki autar' will be born in the respected and noble dynasty of his land. And this is also true as regards Muhammed (saw) as he was born in the respected tribe of Quraish who enjoyed great respect and high place in Makkah.
6. 'Kalki Autar' will be taught in the cave by Bhagwan through his own messenger. And it is very true in this matter. Muhammed (saw) was the only one person in Makkah who has taught by Allah's Messenger Gabriel in the cave of Hira.
7. It is written in the books which Hindus believe that Bhagwan will provide 'Kalki autar' with the fastest of a horse and with the help of which he will ride around the world and the seven skies/heavens. The riding on 'Buraq' and 'Meraj' by the Prophet Muhammed (saw) proves what?
8. It is also written in the Hindus' books that 'kalki autar' will be strengthened and heavily helped by Bhagwan. And we know this fact that Muhammed (saw) was aided and reinforced by Allah (swt) through His angels in the battle of Badr.
9. Hindus' books also mention that 'kalki autar' will be an expert in horse riding, arrow shooting, and swordsmanship. What Pundit Vaid Parkash comments in this regard is very important and worth attention and consideration. He writes that the age of horses, swords, and spears is long ago gone and now is the age of modern weapons like tanks, missiles, and guns, and therefore it will be unwise to wait for 'kalki autar' bearing sword and arrows or spears. In reality, the mention in our books of 'kalki autar' is clearly indicative of Muhammed (saw) who was given the heavenly book known as Al-Qur'an.
Copyright © 1997 The Message, an ICNA Publication
"When the practices taught by the Vedas and the institutes of law shall nearly have ceased, and the close of the Kali age shall be nigh, a portion of that divine being who exists of his own spiritual nature in the character of Brahma, and who is the beginning and the end, and who comprehends all things, shall descend upon the earth. He will be born as Kalki in the family of an eminent brahmin of Sambhala village, endowed with the eight superhuman faculties. By his irresistible might he will destroy all the barbarians and thieves, and all whose minds are devoted to iniquity. He will then reestablish righteousness upon earth; and the minds of those who live at the end of the Kali age shall be awakened, and shall be as pellucid as crystal. The men who are thus changed by virtue of that peculiar time shall be as the seeds of human beings, and shall give birth to a race who shall follow the laws of the Krita age, the Age of Purity. As it is said, "When the sun and moon, and the luner asterism Tishya, and the planet Jupiter, are in one mansion, the Krita age shall return."
It is not written here that Kalki avtar will be the messenger of God. It is not mentioned that he will born in Arabia. The name "Sambhala village" is mentioned. No one really knows where this village is.
Secondly as per Hadiths Prophet Muhammad liked eating dates, however, I dont think there is mention of him eating olives, although there are some references to olive oil.
Also No where there is mentioned that God will guide kalki avtar with angels in a cave and God would also avail kalki avatar with divine help.
According to Hindu scriptures, kalki like other avtars will be himself divine
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heartbreakkid
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Verily We have sent thee (Muhammad) in truth as a bearer of glad tidings and as a warner: And there never was a people without a warner having lived among them (in the past).
Qur'an 16:36
For We assuredly sent amongst every People an apostle (with the Command) "Serve Allah and eshew Evil": Of the people were some whom Allah guided and some on whom Error became inevitably (established). So travel through the earth and see what was the end of those who denied (the Truth).
Qur'an 4:164
[latest example is USA ]
Brahma = Abraham[ dont b surprised bcoz if u read quran allah[swt] gave him a vaaaaaaaaaast kingdom]
Saraswati = Sarah[as]
Manu, Manuh = Nuh[as]
It is well known that the Hindus love hero worship, and it is reasonable to assume that over a long period of time the high regard and reverence for some Prophets led to some of them considered as god or God. Further, it is likely that the Book of Abraham and those of other Prophets contained prophecies about the Last Prophet, Muhammad (s). Muslim historians of India hold the opinion that the graves of Prophets Sheesh and Ayyub (Job) are in Ayodhya, in the province of Uttar Pradesh, India. In ancient times, Ayodhya was known as Khosla according to Shatpath Brahmanas.
Atharva Veda X, 2, 33: [On Abraham and more on Holy Sanctuary and Ka’bah]
Brahma (Abraham) stayed in this abode which is illumined by heavenly light and covered with Divine blessings. It is the place that gives (spiritual) life to the people and is unconquerable.
The Ka’bah was built by Prophets Abraham and Ismail. It has remained unconquerable as explained in the preceding verse. Many verses of the Holy Qur’an and of the Old Testament in the Bible describe the divine blessings in this Holy house.
**************
The Sama Veda contains many prophecies of the advent of Prophet Mohammad. Here, one of them is presented. It is found in Sama Veda, II:6,8:
"Ahmad acquired religious law (Shariah) from his Lord. This religious law is full of wisdom. I receive light from him just as from the sun."
Prophet Muhammad’s other name was Ahmad (both are from root letters h, m and d), both words have the meaning the “praised one” except the latter emphasizes a higher degree to it. The Holy Qur’an states that Prophet ‘Isa (Jesus, pbuh) mentioned the last Prophet’s name as Ahmad.
************
Prophecy In Rig Veda:
Rig Veda V, 27, 1:
The wagon-possessor, the truthful and truth-loving, extremely wise, powerful and generous, Mamah [Mohammad] has favored me with his words. The son of the All-powerful, possessing all good attributes, the mercy for the worlds has become famous with ten thousand [companions].
It refers to ten thousand companions who accompanied the Prophet in the triumphant entry of Makkah and cleansing of Ka’bah of Idols and other profanities.
**********
Prati Sarag Parv III Khand 3 Adhay 3 Shloka 5 to 8
"A foreigner spiritual teacher will appear with his companions. His name will be Mohammad. Raja (Bhoj) after giving this Maha Dev Arab (of angelic disposition) a bath in the Panchgavya and the Ganga water (i.e. purifying him of all sins) offered him the present of his sincere devotion and showing him all reverence said, "I make obeisance to thee. O ye! The pride of mankind, the dweller in Arabia, Ye have collected a great force to kill the Devil and you yourself have been protected from the malecha opponents."
He is referred as the pride of mankind (Parbatis nath). The Glorious Qur’an reconfirms this
"And thou (standest) on an exalted standard of character"
[Al-Qur'an 68:4]
"Ye have indeed in the Messenger of Allah, a beautiful pattern (of conduct)".
[Al-Qur'an 33:21]
Bhavishya Purana in the Pratisarag Parv III Khand 3 Adhay 3 Shloka 10 to 27
"The Malecha have spoiled the well-known land of the Arabs. Arya Dharma is not to be found in the country. Before also there appeared a misguided fiend whom I had killed; he has now again appeared being sent by a powerful enemy. To show these enemies the right path and to give them guidance, the well-known Muhammad (pbuh), is busy in bringing the Pishachas to the right path. O Raja, You need not go to the land of the foolish Pishachas, you will be purified through my kindness even where you are. At night, he of the angelic disposition, the shrewd man, in the guise of Pishacha said to Raja Bhoj, "O Raja! Your Arya Dharma has been made to prevail over all religions, but according to the commandments of Ishwar Parmatma, I shall enforce the strong creed of the meat eaters. My followers will be men circumcised, without a tail (on his head), keeping beard, creating a revolution announcing the Aadhaan (the Muslim call for prayer) and will be eating all lawful things. He will eat all sorts of animals except swine. They will not seek purification from the holy shrubs, but will be purified through warfare. On account of their fighting the irreligious nations, they will be known as Musalmaans. I shall be the originator of this religion of the meat-eating nations."
****
Bhavishya Purana, Parv - III Khand 1 Adhay 3 Shloka 21-23:
"Corruption and persecution are found in seven sacred cities of Kashi, etc. India is inhabited by Rakshas, Shabor, Bhil and other foolish people. In the land of Malechhas, the followers of the Malechha dharma (Islam) are wise and brave people. All good qualities are found in Musalmaans and all sorts of vices have accumulated in the land of the Aryas. Islam will rule in India and its islands. Having known these facts, O Muni, glorify the name of thy lord".
*****
Atharvaveda Book XX Hymn 21 verse 6,
"Lord of the truthful! These liberators drink these feats of bravery and the inspiring songs gladdened thee in the field of battle. When thou renders vanquished without fight the ten thousand opponents of the praying one, the adoring one."
*****
The enemies’ defeat in the conquest of Makkah is mentioned in Atharvaveda book 20 Hymn 21 verse no 9:
"You have O Indra, overthrown 20 kings and 60,099 men with an outstripping Chariot wheel who came to fight the praised one or far famed (Muhammad) orphan."
*****
Chapter 12 of the Kalki-Purana
" 'Jagatguru' will be born of 'Bishnuvagat' in the woumb of 'Sumati'.He will be born '2 hours after sunrise' on Monday, the 12th of 'Baishakh'. His father will die before his birth and his mother some time later after his birth. 'Jagatguru' will marry the princess of the 'Salmal' island. His uncle and three brothers will be present in his marriage ceremony. 'Pars-Ram' will teach him in a cave. When he will come to 'Sambala' from 'Salmal' island, to preach his teachings, his relatives will oppose him. He will be bound to migrate to the 'Northern Hills' to avoid the on-going torture and persecution. But after some time, he will return to 'Sambala' with 'sword in hand' and will 'conquer the whole land'. 'Jagatguru' will visit earth and the seven heavens riding on a 'horse' ".
********
Qur'an 16:36
For We assuredly sent amongst every People an apostle (with the Command) "Serve Allah and eshew Evil": Of the people were some whom Allah guided and some on whom Error became inevitably (established). So travel through the earth and see what was the end of those who denied (the Truth).
Qur'an 4:164
[latest example is USA
]Brahma = Abraham[ dont b surprised bcoz if u read quran allah[swt] gave him a vaaaaaaaaaast kingdom]
Saraswati = Sarah[as]
Manu, Manuh = Nuh[as]
It is well known that the Hindus love hero worship, and it is reasonable to assume that over a long period of time the high regard and reverence for some Prophets led to some of them considered as god or God. Further, it is likely that the Book of Abraham and those of other Prophets contained prophecies about the Last Prophet, Muhammad (s). Muslim historians of India hold the opinion that the graves of Prophets Sheesh and Ayyub (Job) are in Ayodhya, in the province of Uttar Pradesh, India. In ancient times, Ayodhya was known as Khosla according to Shatpath Brahmanas.
Atharva Veda X, 2, 33: [On Abraham and more on Holy Sanctuary and Ka’bah]
Brahma (Abraham) stayed in this abode which is illumined by heavenly light and covered with Divine blessings. It is the place that gives (spiritual) life to the people and is unconquerable.
The Ka’bah was built by Prophets Abraham and Ismail. It has remained unconquerable as explained in the preceding verse. Many verses of the Holy Qur’an and of the Old Testament in the Bible describe the divine blessings in this Holy house.
**************
The Sama Veda contains many prophecies of the advent of Prophet Mohammad. Here, one of them is presented. It is found in Sama Veda, II:6,8:
"Ahmad acquired religious law (Shariah) from his Lord. This religious law is full of wisdom. I receive light from him just as from the sun."
Prophet Muhammad’s other name was Ahmad (both are from root letters h, m and d), both words have the meaning the “praised one” except the latter emphasizes a higher degree to it. The Holy Qur’an states that Prophet ‘Isa (Jesus, pbuh) mentioned the last Prophet’s name as Ahmad.
************
Prophecy In Rig Veda:
Rig Veda V, 27, 1:
The wagon-possessor, the truthful and truth-loving, extremely wise, powerful and generous, Mamah [Mohammad] has favored me with his words. The son of the All-powerful, possessing all good attributes, the mercy for the worlds has become famous with ten thousand [companions].
It refers to ten thousand companions who accompanied the Prophet in the triumphant entry of Makkah and cleansing of Ka’bah of Idols and other profanities.
**********
Prati Sarag Parv III Khand 3 Adhay 3 Shloka 5 to 8
"A foreigner spiritual teacher will appear with his companions. His name will be Mohammad. Raja (Bhoj) after giving this Maha Dev Arab (of angelic disposition) a bath in the Panchgavya and the Ganga water (i.e. purifying him of all sins) offered him the present of his sincere devotion and showing him all reverence said, "I make obeisance to thee. O ye! The pride of mankind, the dweller in Arabia, Ye have collected a great force to kill the Devil and you yourself have been protected from the malecha opponents."
He is referred as the pride of mankind (Parbatis nath). The Glorious Qur’an reconfirms this
"And thou (standest) on an exalted standard of character"
[Al-Qur'an 68:4]
"Ye have indeed in the Messenger of Allah, a beautiful pattern (of conduct)".
[Al-Qur'an 33:21]
Bhavishya Purana in the Pratisarag Parv III Khand 3 Adhay 3 Shloka 10 to 27
"The Malecha have spoiled the well-known land of the Arabs. Arya Dharma is not to be found in the country. Before also there appeared a misguided fiend whom I had killed; he has now again appeared being sent by a powerful enemy. To show these enemies the right path and to give them guidance, the well-known Muhammad (pbuh), is busy in bringing the Pishachas to the right path. O Raja, You need not go to the land of the foolish Pishachas, you will be purified through my kindness even where you are. At night, he of the angelic disposition, the shrewd man, in the guise of Pishacha said to Raja Bhoj, "O Raja! Your Arya Dharma has been made to prevail over all religions, but according to the commandments of Ishwar Parmatma, I shall enforce the strong creed of the meat eaters. My followers will be men circumcised, without a tail (on his head), keeping beard, creating a revolution announcing the Aadhaan (the Muslim call for prayer) and will be eating all lawful things. He will eat all sorts of animals except swine. They will not seek purification from the holy shrubs, but will be purified through warfare. On account of their fighting the irreligious nations, they will be known as Musalmaans. I shall be the originator of this religion of the meat-eating nations."
****
Bhavishya Purana, Parv - III Khand 1 Adhay 3 Shloka 21-23:
"Corruption and persecution are found in seven sacred cities of Kashi, etc. India is inhabited by Rakshas, Shabor, Bhil and other foolish people. In the land of Malechhas, the followers of the Malechha dharma (Islam) are wise and brave people. All good qualities are found in Musalmaans and all sorts of vices have accumulated in the land of the Aryas. Islam will rule in India and its islands. Having known these facts, O Muni, glorify the name of thy lord".
*****
Atharvaveda Book XX Hymn 21 verse 6,
"Lord of the truthful! These liberators drink these feats of bravery and the inspiring songs gladdened thee in the field of battle. When thou renders vanquished without fight the ten thousand opponents of the praying one, the adoring one."
*****
The enemies’ defeat in the conquest of Makkah is mentioned in Atharvaveda book 20 Hymn 21 verse no 9:
"You have O Indra, overthrown 20 kings and 60,099 men with an outstripping Chariot wheel who came to fight the praised one or far famed (Muhammad) orphan."
*****
Chapter 12 of the Kalki-Purana
" 'Jagatguru' will be born of 'Bishnuvagat' in the woumb of 'Sumati'.He will be born '2 hours after sunrise' on Monday, the 12th of 'Baishakh'. His father will die before his birth and his mother some time later after his birth. 'Jagatguru' will marry the princess of the 'Salmal' island. His uncle and three brothers will be present in his marriage ceremony. 'Pars-Ram' will teach him in a cave. When he will come to 'Sambala' from 'Salmal' island, to preach his teachings, his relatives will oppose him. He will be bound to migrate to the 'Northern Hills' to avoid the on-going torture and persecution. But after some time, he will return to 'Sambala' with 'sword in hand' and will 'conquer the whole land'. 'Jagatguru' will visit earth and the seven heavens riding on a 'horse' ".
********
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star_munir
- Posts: 1670
- Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2003 12:55 am
- Contact:
Ya Ali Madad,heartbreakkid wrote:Verily We have sent thee (Muhammad) in truth as a bearer of glad tidings and as a warner: And there never was a people without a warner having lived among them (in the past).
Qur'an 16:36
For We assuredly sent amongst every People an apostle (with the Command) "Serve Allah and eshew Evil": Of the people were some whom Allah guided and some on whom Error became inevitably (established). So travel through the earth and see what was the end of those who denied (the Truth).
Qur'an 4:164
[latest example is USA
Brahma = Abraham[ dont b surprised bcoz if u read quran allah[swt] gave him a vaaaaaaaaaast kingdom]
Saraswati = Sarah[as]
Manu, Manuh = Nuh[as]
It is well known that the Hindus love hero worship, and it is reasonable to assume that over a long period of time the high regard and reverence for some Prophets led to some of them considered as god or God. Further, it is likely that the Book of Abraham and those of other Prophets contained prophecies about the Last Prophet, Muhammad (s). Muslim historians of India hold the opinion that the graves of Prophets Sheesh and Ayyub (Job) are in Ayodhya, in the province of Uttar Pradesh, India. In ancient times, Ayodhya was known as Khosla according to Shatpath Brahmanas.
Atharva Veda X, 2, 33: [On Abraham and more on Holy Sanctuary and Ka’bah]
Brahma (Abraham) stayed in this abode which is illumined by heavenly light and covered with Divine blessings. It is the place that gives (spiritual) life to the people and is unconquerable.
The Ka’bah was built by Prophets Abraham and Ismail. It has remained unconquerable as explained in the preceding verse. Many verses of the Holy Qur’an and of the Old Testament in the Bible describe the divine blessings in this Holy house.
**************
The Sama Veda contains many prophecies of the advent of Prophet Mohammad. Here, one of them is presented. It is found in Sama Veda, II:6,8:
"Ahmad acquired religious law (Shariah) from his Lord. This religious law is full of wisdom. I receive light from him just as from the sun."
Prophet Muhammad’s other name was Ahmad (both are from root letters h, m and d), both words have the meaning the “praised one” except the latter emphasizes a higher degree to it. The Holy Qur’an states that Prophet ‘Isa (Jesus, pbuh) mentioned the last Prophet’s name as Ahmad.
************
Prophecy In Rig Veda:
Rig Veda V, 27, 1:
The wagon-possessor, the truthful and truth-loving, extremely wise, powerful and generous, Mamah [Mohammad] has favored me with his words. The son of the All-powerful, possessing all good attributes, the mercy for the worlds has become famous with ten thousand [companions].
It refers to ten thousand companions who accompanied the Prophet in the triumphant entry of Makkah and cleansing of Ka’bah of Idols and other profanities.
**********
Prati Sarag Parv III Khand 3 Adhay 3 Shloka 5 to 8
"A foreigner spiritual teacher will appear with his companions. His name will be Mohammad. Raja (Bhoj) after giving this Maha Dev Arab (of angelic disposition) a bath in the Panchgavya and the Ganga water (i.e. purifying him of all sins) offered him the present of his sincere devotion and showing him all reverence said, "I make obeisance to thee. O ye! The pride of mankind, the dweller in Arabia, Ye have collected a great force to kill the Devil and you yourself have been protected from the malecha opponents."
He is referred as the pride of mankind (Parbatis nath). The Glorious Qur’an reconfirms this
"And thou (standest) on an exalted standard of character"
[Al-Qur'an 68:4]
"Ye have indeed in the Messenger of Allah, a beautiful pattern (of conduct)".
[Al-Qur'an 33:21]
Bhavishya Purana in the Pratisarag Parv III Khand 3 Adhay 3 Shloka 10 to 27
"The Malecha have spoiled the well-known land of the Arabs. Arya Dharma is not to be found in the country. Before also there appeared a misguided fiend whom I had killed; he has now again appeared being sent by a powerful enemy. To show these enemies the right path and to give them guidance, the well-known Muhammad (pbuh), is busy in bringing the Pishachas to the right path. O Raja, You need not go to the land of the foolish Pishachas, you will be purified through my kindness even where you are. At night, he of the angelic disposition, the shrewd man, in the guise of Pishacha said to Raja Bhoj, "O Raja! Your Arya Dharma has been made to prevail over all religions, but according to the commandments of Ishwar Parmatma, I shall enforce the strong creed of the meat eaters. My followers will be men circumcised, without a tail (on his head), keeping beard, creating a revolution announcing the Aadhaan (the Muslim call for prayer) and will be eating all lawful things. He will eat all sorts of animals except swine. They will not seek purification from the holy shrubs, but will be purified through warfare. On account of their fighting the irreligious nations, they will be known as Musalmaans. I shall be the originator of this religion of the meat-eating nations."
****
Bhavishya Purana, Parv - III Khand 1 Adhay 3 Shloka 21-23:
"Corruption and persecution are found in seven sacred cities of Kashi, etc. India is inhabited by Rakshas, Shabor, Bhil and other foolish people. In the land of Malechhas, the followers of the Malechha dharma (Islam) are wise and brave people. All good qualities are found in Musalmaans and all sorts of vices have accumulated in the land of the Aryas. Islam will rule in India and its islands. Having known these facts, O Muni, glorify the name of thy lord".
*****
Atharvaveda Book XX Hymn 21 verse 6,
"Lord of the truthful! These liberators drink these feats of bravery and the inspiring songs gladdened thee in the field of battle. When thou renders vanquished without fight the ten thousand opponents of the praying one, the adoring one."
*****
The enemies’ defeat in the conquest of Makkah is mentioned in Atharvaveda book 20 Hymn 21 verse no 9:
"You have O Indra, overthrown 20 kings and 60,099 men with an outstripping Chariot wheel who came to fight the praised one or far famed (Muhammad) orphan."
*****
Chapter 12 of the Kalki-Purana
" 'Jagatguru' will be born of 'Bishnuvagat' in the woumb of 'Sumati'.He will be born '2 hours after sunrise' on Monday, the 12th of 'Baishakh'. His father will die before his birth and his mother some time later after his birth. 'Jagatguru' will marry the princess of the 'Salmal' island. His uncle and three brothers will be present in his marriage ceremony. 'Pars-Ram' will teach him in a cave. When he will come to 'Sambala' from 'Salmal' island, to preach his teachings, his relatives will oppose him. He will be bound to migrate to the 'Northern Hills' to avoid the on-going torture and persecution. But after some time, he will return to 'Sambala' with 'sword in hand' and will 'conquer the whole land'. 'Jagatguru' will visit earth and the seven heavens riding on a 'horse' ".
********
Syed Imam Shah has said in one of his ginans that Gita and Veds have praises of Mowla. I do agree that there are prophecies in scriptures of Hinduism about Prophet Muhammad and Mowla Ali but However, this article is very misleading and full of inaccuracy.
The translation of verses is fake. The word "Ahmed", "Muhammad", "Islam", "Muslim" etc are not clearly stated in any Hindu scripture.
The following translation is really FUNNY
*******************************************************
Bhavishya Purana, Parv - III Khand 1 Adhay 3 Shloka 21-23:
"Corruption and persecution are found in seven sacred cities of Kashi, etc. India is inhabited by Rakshas, Shabor, Bhil and other foolish people. In the land of Malechhas, the followers of the Malechha dharma (Islam) are wise and brave people. All good qualities are found in Musalmaans and all sorts of vices have accumulated in the land of the Aryas. Islam will rule in India and its islands. Having known these facts, O Muni, glorify the name of thy lord".
*******************************************************
Now isnt it funny? The holy book of hindus is criticizing India and people living there and are praising Muslims and foretelling that Muslim will rule in India. The book was composed long back from the time of Prophet Muhammad.
The most strange thing is in the verse quoted above Malechha are written as momins and Aryas are written as evil doers, whereas the same article mentions another verse from same book Bhavisha Puran in the Pratisarag Parv III, which shows Malechaa as evil doers and Arya dharma as true religion. What a contradiction ! The author is making fool to others. Only foolish can accept such translations.
The way the verses describes about meat eating, azaan, Musalman etc clearly shows that the translation is completely fake.
In the explanation of the poem ‘Gita Govinda Mahakavya’ of 13th Century Poet Jayadeva, a prominent mystic and devotee of Sri Krishna who lived in the 12th century, it is stated:
“The last incarnation of the ten is yet to be as Kalki, the mighty warrior, born in a pious family, to rid the world of the oppression of its unrighteous rulers.”
These are the qualities of Hazarat Ali.
The article can be referenced in this forum at:
Anecdotes --> The DARSHAN OF DAS AVTAAR
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... opic&t=344
“The last incarnation of the ten is yet to be as Kalki, the mighty warrior, born in a pious family, to rid the world of the oppression of its unrighteous rulers.”
These are the qualities of Hazarat Ali.
The article can be referenced in this forum at:
Anecdotes --> The DARSHAN OF DAS AVTAAR
http://www.ismaili.net/html/modules.php ... opic&t=344
http://ismaili.net/heritage/node/20332
http://ismaili.net/heritage/node/20331
visit this link, it leads to a table recently added to the new Heritage website, explaining a lot about this subject. Surely you will not regret it.
Admin
http://ismaili.net/heritage/node/20331
visit this link, it leads to a table recently added to the new Heritage website, explaining a lot about this subject. Surely you will not regret it.
Admin
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heartbreakkid_1
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star_munir
- Posts: 1670
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- Contact:
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heartbreakkid_1
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heartbreakkid_1
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2009 5:52 pm
No.heartbreakkid wrote:u mean to say pir sadardin lived some 7000 years ago = before the arrival of prophet muhammad[saw] ??
sorry but iam confused
it had been 5400-500 years since kaljug started during the time of the prophet.
Pir Sadardeen lived about 500 or so years ago (off by a century maybe?) - and as per his ginans..it had been 7000 years during his time since Kaljug started.
The advent of Kaljug began with the retreat of the Pandavas to the Himalayas.
Shams
Shams,ShamsB wrote:it had been 5400-500 years since kaljug started during the time of the prophet.
Pir Sadardeen lived about 500 or so years ago (off by a century maybe?) - and as per his ginans..it had been 7000 years during his time since Kaljug started.
The advent of Kaljug began with the retreat of the Pandavas to the Himalayas.
Shams
Which ginans state 5000 years?
The Ginan verse that states the arrival of Kaljug:
Sat gayu(n) pandovone saath, kaljug bettho tenni-j sat..220 (Khat Nirinjan)
The truth left with the Pandavs, Kaljug took its place....
Kal Jug started with Buddh Awatar also known as Hazrat Honayd and his son Adam that left the Indian subcontinent for Middle East.
Subsequent to the Imamat of Buddh Awatar [or Hazrat Honayd if you like arabic names better then Indian names] the Imamat went to the grand son Shish [the son of Adam] to continue up to modern times.
So Adam was skipped in the line of Imamat as he never became Imam [Imam Mustakar], he became Prophet instead [Maybe Pir, Imam Mustawda] Please see the Pre-Adam section in this Forum for more.
You can read Buddh Awatar Granth in the Ginan section or the article on the Fall of Adam in the Library section under suggested readings.
This subject is obviously a bridge subject between Doctrines and Pre Adam section so the info is scattered on this Forum.
Admin
Subsequent to the Imamat of Buddh Awatar [or Hazrat Honayd if you like arabic names better then Indian names] the Imamat went to the grand son Shish [the son of Adam] to continue up to modern times.
So Adam was skipped in the line of Imamat as he never became Imam [Imam Mustakar], he became Prophet instead [Maybe Pir, Imam Mustawda] Please see the Pre-Adam section in this Forum for more.
You can read Buddh Awatar Granth in the Ginan section or the article on the Fall of Adam in the Library section under suggested readings.
This subject is obviously a bridge subject between Doctrines and Pre Adam section so the info is scattered on this Forum.
Admin
The truth left with the Pandavs, Kaljug took its place....
so exactly how many years its been ??
some say that it was imam hunayd who gave us the quran, is this true ??
if i agree wid this then quran is jus 1400 years old then how come an imam who lived some 6-7000 years ago gave us the quran which v r reading some 1400 years ago ????
adam= human,man,earth [ plz check the defination ]
so if adam was son of imam hunayd = allah then how come allah never mentioned him as his son in quran ??? as far as i know we read in our 6th part of dua
KULHUALLAHU AHAD
ALLAH HU SAMAD
LAM YALID
WALAMULAD
WALAM YAKULAHUKUFUANAHAD
as far as i know quran is the book of god.
ismaili constitution :
BISMI-LLAHI-R-RAHMANI-R-RAHIM
(A) The Shia Imami Ismaili Muslims affirm the Shahadah 'La ilaha illa-llah, Muhammadur Rasulu-llah', the Tawhid therein and that the Holy Prophet Muhammad (Salla-llahu 'alayhi wa-sallam) is the last and final Prophet of Allah. Islam, as revealed in the Holy Quran, is the final message of Allah to mankind, and is universal and eternal.The Holy Prophet (S.A.S.) through the divine revelation from Allah prescribed rules governing spiritual and temporal matters.
soo............ if imam hunaid = owner/speaker/author of quran then he must have given this quran to his son SETH[as] some thousand years ago ! y did he gave his psalms then ????
all v know is about the books TORAH,INJEEL,ZABUR AND HOLY QURAN
history says that seth was the successor of his father H ADAM[AS] so he inherited naboowat and not imamat from his father, seth received revelations from allah[swt] so how can an imam = allah can receive revelations from allah ???
87:18 (Y. Ali) And this is in the Books of the earliest (Revelation),-
if imam hunayd lived some 6-7000 years ago then shud v all assume that life as a human being started some 6-7000 years ago ???
so exactly how many years its been ??
some say that it was imam hunayd who gave us the quran, is this true ??
if i agree wid this then quran is jus 1400 years old then how come an imam who lived some 6-7000 years ago gave us the quran which v r reading some 1400 years ago ????
adam= human,man,earth [ plz check the defination ]
so if adam was son of imam hunayd = allah then how come allah never mentioned him as his son in quran ??? as far as i know we read in our 6th part of dua
KULHUALLAHU AHAD
ALLAH HU SAMAD
LAM YALID
WALAMULAD
WALAM YAKULAHUKUFUANAHAD
as far as i know quran is the book of god.
ismaili constitution :
BISMI-LLAHI-R-RAHMANI-R-RAHIM
(A) The Shia Imami Ismaili Muslims affirm the Shahadah 'La ilaha illa-llah, Muhammadur Rasulu-llah', the Tawhid therein and that the Holy Prophet Muhammad (Salla-llahu 'alayhi wa-sallam) is the last and final Prophet of Allah. Islam, as revealed in the Holy Quran, is the final message of Allah to mankind, and is universal and eternal.The Holy Prophet (S.A.S.) through the divine revelation from Allah prescribed rules governing spiritual and temporal matters.
soo............ if imam hunaid = owner/speaker/author of quran then he must have given this quran to his son SETH[as] some thousand years ago ! y did he gave his psalms then ????
all v know is about the books TORAH,INJEEL,ZABUR AND HOLY QURAN
history says that seth was the successor of his father H ADAM[AS] so he inherited naboowat and not imamat from his father, seth received revelations from allah[swt] so how can an imam = allah can receive revelations from allah ???
87:18 (Y. Ali) And this is in the Books of the earliest (Revelation),-
if imam hunayd lived some 6-7000 years ago then shud v all assume that life as a human being started some 6-7000 years ago ???
The old Dua stated Bouddh ma thi Shish which means the Imamat went from Buddh to Shish. The usmani compilation of the Quran mentions many prophets but does name only few names, who were the other prophets?
If The written Usmani Quran compilation is the Quran you are referring to, where was it when God said that I have perfected your religion, that book did not exist, it was compiled much later heartbreakkid. How could the religion be perfect without the existence of that compilation, well if God spoke the truth, he did not need a compilation by humans to get his own Eternal Quran.
If Quran has started existing only 1400 years ago which we disagree then your God was sleeping before? Our Allah has made the Quran since the begining of Beginings so obviously when we talk of the Quran and you talk of the Quran, we are not talking of the same thing. Our Miraculous Quran is eternal, your quran is it just a document which appeared after the Religion was already perfected by Allah?
There is nothing in your post above that has not been replied and addressed previously. Read the postings on the subject before starting to post or your account will be deleted soon.
Admin
If The written Usmani Quran compilation is the Quran you are referring to, where was it when God said that I have perfected your religion, that book did not exist, it was compiled much later heartbreakkid. How could the religion be perfect without the existence of that compilation, well if God spoke the truth, he did not need a compilation by humans to get his own Eternal Quran.
If Quran has started existing only 1400 years ago which we disagree then your God was sleeping before? Our Allah has made the Quran since the begining of Beginings so obviously when we talk of the Quran and you talk of the Quran, we are not talking of the same thing. Our Miraculous Quran is eternal, your quran is it just a document which appeared after the Religion was already perfected by Allah?
There is nothing in your post above that has not been replied and addressed previously. Read the postings on the subject before starting to post or your account will be deleted soon.
Admin
bro admin , i think u seriously have some problems with me bro
is it a sin to ask a question if i have doubts ???
what ur problem ??? y do u keep deleting my posts ?? are u scared of me or my questions ??
why do u keep running from me when i ask u something ???
i told u last time and iam repeating myself again , iam a shia imami ismaili muslim but being a ismaili, does it mean that v have the knowledge of everything ???
plz instead of showing me ur ignorant side HELP ME by sharing ur thought and views in the light of holy ginans,firmans and aayats
thank you
is it a sin to ask a question if i have doubts ???
what ur problem ??? y do u keep deleting my posts ?? are u scared of me or my questions ??
why do u keep running from me when i ask u something ???
i told u last time and iam repeating myself again , iam a shia imami ismaili muslim but being a ismaili, does it mean that v have the knowledge of everything ???
plz instead of showing me ur ignorant side HELP ME by sharing ur thought and views in the light of holy ginans,firmans and aayats
thank you
bro kmeherali
you said :
Incomplete Quran does not mean that it is false or invalid. It just means that by itself it is an inadequate source of guidance.
bro meherali tell me this
can u travel [from one place to another] on an incomplete bride ???
can u reach ur destination if ur route is incomplete ??
can u pass ur exam if ur answer is incomplete ???
when v cannot do anything with tht which is incomplete then HOW CAN V PRAY FROM A SCRIPTURE WHICH ACCORDING TO SOME OF U IS INCOMPLETE ?
PLZ THINK OVER !!!
"The Qur'an itself repeatedly recommends Muslims to become better educated in order better to understand God's creation"
(ClosingAddress by His Highness Aga Khan IV at the "Musée-Musées" Round Table Louvre Museum, Paris, France, October 17th 2007)
"......The Quran tells us that signs of Allah's Sovereignty are found in the contemplation of His Creation - in the heavens and the earth, the night and the day, the clouds and the seas, the winds and the waters...."
(Aga Khan IV, Kampala, Uganda, August 22 2007)
you said :
Incomplete Quran does not mean that it is false or invalid. It just means that by itself it is an inadequate source of guidance.
bro meherali tell me this
can u travel [from one place to another] on an incomplete bride ???
can u reach ur destination if ur route is incomplete ??
can u pass ur exam if ur answer is incomplete ???
when v cannot do anything with tht which is incomplete then HOW CAN V PRAY FROM A SCRIPTURE WHICH ACCORDING TO SOME OF U IS INCOMPLETE ?
PLZ THINK OVER !!!
"The Qur'an itself repeatedly recommends Muslims to become better educated in order better to understand God's creation"
(ClosingAddress by His Highness Aga Khan IV at the "Musée-Musées" Round Table Louvre Museum, Paris, France, October 17th 2007)
"......The Quran tells us that signs of Allah's Sovereignty are found in the contemplation of His Creation - in the heavens and the earth, the night and the day, the clouds and the seas, the winds and the waters...."
(Aga Khan IV, Kampala, Uganda, August 22 2007)
If you were to use the Quran only you will not reach far on the Path. You need the Imam to interpret it according to time.786786 wrote: can u travel [from one place to another] on an incomplete bride ???
can u reach ur destination if ur route is incomplete ??
can u pass ur exam if ur answer is incomplete ???
when v cannot do anything with tht which is incomplete then HOW CAN V PRAY FROM A SCRIPTURE WHICH ACCORDING TO SOME OF U IS INCOMPLETE ?
PLZ THINK OVER !!!
"The Qur'an itself repeatedly recommends Muslims to become better educated in order better to understand God's creation"
(ClosingAddress by His Highness Aga Khan IV at the "Musée-Musées" Round Table Louvre Museum, Paris, France, October 17th 2007)
"......The Quran tells us that signs of Allah's Sovereignty are found in the contemplation of His Creation - in the heavens and the earth, the night and the day, the clouds and the seas, the winds and the waters...."
(Aga Khan IV, Kampala, Uganda, August 22 2007)
We are not using the entire Quran in our prayer but only parts of it. Using a few verses from the Quran does not make it complete, it just makes it a valid scripture for our reflection and contemplation.
Hazar Imam referencing the Quran just makes it a valid reference, it does not mean that it is complete.
The Imam completes the Quran. By itself it is incomplete, not NOT invalid or false. In his GJ Darbar Irshad to the Dar-es-Salaam MHI told the Jamat to study the Quran under the guidance of the Imam, not by ourselves. If we study it by ourselves, we can get misled by it.